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Lindsay I'm so sorry. As others said, it's quite normal not to have a D&C - I didn't after mine at 9 weeks. It just means it takes a little longer to pass, but allows your body to recover naturally. Please don't think that you won't be able to carry a baby. Last summer I had a positive test but then started bleeding (so about 4 1/2 weeks) - a lot of pg are lost at that early stage, we just find out about it more now because the tests are so much more sensitive.

And Blanche, i tried to reply to your post on Friday but the machine ate my post - i think the comment i made was after an insensitive comment from my ultrasound tech - just that her bedside manner sucked. In terms of benefits and healthcare I definitely think we have it better here.

16 weeks yesterday! I'm starting to show and I LOVE my new boobs!

edit - thought others might find this article 'the tyranny of pink' interesting if i can make the link work -,00.html
oops double post
beck- thanks for that article! I was having an errily similar conversation with my sister on that topic yesterday!

Lindsey- I'm so sorry. Just rest, and let the hubby take care of you.
boobs - mine would still be considered small by most standards, i started off a small b cup, they have mostly filled out from the top if that makes sense, so they are rounder and fuller but probably not a bigger cup size, although my band size has gone from a 36 to a 38. I managed to get a comfy sports bra and some soft cup triangle bras which are fine for now, the maternity ones in my size are still too big!
Beck that article was pretty interesting. I agree that it sucks that there is a lack of choice. For more on taking back pink, listen to the "Pink" story from the "Boys Vs. Girls" show from Re:Sound. I can't link directly, but the show is from last week and is about halfway down the page. The "Sleep Over" segment is also just adorable....there is an imbedded player, but you can also find this on iTunes.

My boobs are uber sore, but I haven't had to buy anything new yet. And I haven't gained any weight, though my pants fit differently. As I've said before sometimes I wonder if i'm really preggers.
Very interesting article. This is something I think about a lot. It's also one reason I'm glad I had a boy, as much as I really wanted a girl. (Now, of course I'm very happy with my boy, and there are some related challenges in boy raising in terms of narrowing their options, etc, etc, etc.)

I have always HATED pink. I hated it as a kid, and I don't like it now. If I'd had a girl I would have made a very specific effort to keep away from the pink. And it would be a hell of a challenge. I'm already seeing it in my 17 month old--and have been for a while. It's very hard to find neutral clothes. Boys clothes are cars, monsters, camo, sports. Girls clothes are flowers and pink, pink, pink, pink. (And make no mistake, they are all either "boys' or "girls" clothes.

He's a baby. What's wrong with teddy bears, animals, or other cute things. What's the rush?

And I do think there is a rather sinister implication in the pink culture--you can be a ballerina or princess.
That's even worse than the old "it's either teacher or nurse" culture. At least those are real jobs that take some skills, education, and training. (Most kids aren't going to be professional dancers. And frankly I wouldn't want my little girl in the world of ballet either, considering the culture. )

Best to everyone.
(((((lindsey, take care of yourself)))))

thanks for posting that article, beck! i never really liked pink as a child, or maybe i was just indifferent to it. i must admit that i do like it now, but only in small quantities. if we have a girl, i would only want to have small quantities of it for her, as well (at least while she's quite young)...and buying for friends who have recently had babies - veeeeery frustrating to only choose from "boys" or "girls" clothing/toys.

hopefully we'll find out in a couple of days if we're having a boy or a girl!

(((lindsey))) i am sorry!! i know it seems crushing right now, but this doesn't indicate that you're not capable of having a baby! it sounds like you had a blighted ovum, which i suffered nearly three years ago. it was devastating but i also reminded myself that it was my body's way of making sure things went well. it's likely that the chromosomes didn't match up well in fertilization or that there was one missing. as blanche said, it happens often and if the hpts weren't so damn sensitive, we'd never have known we were pregnant in the first place. i know you've been dealing with this for some time (i've read your posts in the infertility thread) but please do not lose hope. remember that your body is an incredible vessel and it "knows" what is best right now. do get some rest though.

i know i'm late to the breastfeeding conversation, but i wanted to add a couple things...when i was pg, my stock answer was, "yes, i plan to breastfeed; i hope i can". i was concerned that wouldn't be able to for some reason, that it would hurt, feel funny, annoy me (i have sensitive nipples), that my a-cups would never be enough to feed my baby, etc. i worried that my propensity for depression would rear up. and of course, i worried that i would get tired of always having to be the one to feed the baby and not be able to let mrfj do it sometimes. so at my baby shower, someone asked the inevitable question and i gave my standard reply. later, while we were in the kitchen, my friend "m" said, "fall, you should really just say yes. period. don't give yourself an out if it's something you really want to do. yeah, you might NOT be able to. but don't focus on that part of it." she went on to remind me that i only have a short window of time to TRY it. and if i couldn't or didn't like it or it just became too much for me - i could stop. i wasn't going to be able to start out with formula and then decide a week later that i'd prefer breastfeeding. she wasn't preachy about it (and i really hope i don't come off that way) and i'm super glad she said it. i was lucky enough that even after a difficult labor turned emergency c-section, my wonderful nurse brought him to me and practically held him to my breast for the first feeding. and now, nearly nine months later, i'm still nursing. and like pepper, i cannot imagine having to get up and make a bottle all bleary-eyed in the middle of the night. blink.gif

basically, i am just saying that it worked for ME. obviously, you all have your own decisions to make and i know you'll make the ones that are best for YOU. but like i said, i'm thankful that my friend said what she did because i think it made me more positive and optimistic. i know all the mothers in this thread made careful decisions based on the individual needs of themselves and their families. and like anoushh said, nothing compares with a loving, caring mother.

and finally, regarding the "pink" article... i guess like anoushh said, it works both ways. we went to targhay over the weekend and purchased the cutest monkey wall decals for jackaroo's room. there are three non-gender-specific monkeys on a tree, several banana bunches and leaves, and a female monkey wearing a grass skirt and a little flower behind her ear (yeah, the flower is pink). i thought nothing of putting it in my boy's room and neither did mrfj. but, of course, the cashier was all, "oh, did you notice it's got a girl on it? i guess you could just cut the flower out of her hair and it would look like a boy". WTF? i was in the ladies room at the time and wish i'd have been there. but mrfj assured her that our child is "man enough" rolleyes.gif to have pink in his room. sheesh.

ok, mamas. i've been writing that post just about all day. look forward to that, hehe. i wish you all the best of luck.

Gah, fj, I can't believe the check-out girl said that to you! It's a freaking monkey and none of her damn business. Reminds me of when LeBoy bought some peach-flavored hard cider at Trader Joe's and the check-out guy said, "Dude, I hope this is for your girlfriend!" We just stood there, slack-jawed. Um, no, some of us don't define our sexuality by what we drink. dry.gif

Yeah, the pink thing bothers me- I don't have kids, but whenever I have to buy a gift for a little girl, I make an effort to at least go for something purple, if not green/yellow/blue, whatever.
The Pink issue doesn't really bother me. I mean, when I was growing up, my mom dressed me in dresses and patent leather shoes. She really wanted me to be a girly girl, but it just wasn't in me. As soon as I could choose I was wearing jeans and Ts. Ultimately the child will voice their own opinion and that will be that. It wasn't until college that I started enjoying dresses again.

It is just as important for the parent to honor the childs likes and dislikes. If your girl (or boy) wants to be a pretty pretty puffy pink princess, not allowing that will only lead to trouble down the line.

Like the article said, this is really about lack of choice not the color pink. And in reality we have lots of choice, lots of alternate vendors owned by women like us who think it's fine for a monkey with flower to be in the boys room. You can buy boys clothes. Make your own.

Mainstream culture buys what the man sells. Today its pink tomorrow it is something else. It is the nature of capitalism, so but your money where you mind is.
wouldn't mind if i have a little boy who wants to wear pink fluff wink.gif at least that would be original!

you're right though kelly, much as i would like a little dungaree-wearing tomboy i'll probably end up with a wannabe fairy princess. as long as they know that it's fine to pretend to be one when you're 5, but not to aspire to that as an adult career a la paris hilton, i'm cool.

i'd better get crafting on some original babywear...
Of course you have to have respect for the kids wishes. What bothers me is the enforced "you must like this" attitude that's around with this crap. What if you are a girl who doesn't like this--you are constantly being told "This is GIRLS' STUFF." Did you notice one girl said she wouldn't want to stand out?

I think the point about creating tiny consumers was a very good one. Also, again, why does everything have to be broken into boy vs. girl? It's idiotic.

I know there are alternatives, but I cannot afford to buy my clothes at the expensive European import/handmade local/etc store. I buy most stuff from Goodwill. And wherever I buy my stuff is kind of irrelevant to the bigger picture. The society my child grows up in is still surrounded by this attitude and I don't like it nor do I like the message it sends. I think there is a message in the color poink.
anybody feel like sharing belly bump pictures? i have a cute 25 week pic but i don't want to be the only one.

Thank you all for your support and kind words. One day I will get to join this thread for at 40 weeks. (all in a row!) Hope everyone is doing well. And Fiddler do put up the cute belly picture.
HI blanche! You are one hott looking preggo lady!! I love the "all belly" shots...reminds me of me until about month 9 when my face POOFED up. Curious, are you taking the shot into a mirror? Never would have thought of that...
wow! moxie's right! blanche, you are smokin'!

and i was the same way, ballooned toward the very end and then my face POOFED in the last month. i was just looking at a baby shower picture on my mother in law's fridge and i look nothing like myself.

i can't wait to see more bellies! smile.gif

i got the poofy face at the end too. very attractive. NOT!
Gorgeous! Blanche, you're so cute! I love it!

Here's me.

(I edited the picture out after a coupla days because I'm self conscious.)

ooh cute pregnant ladies! i'll post one of mine once it's big enough to warrant a pic...
wasn't kelly's doctor visit today? i am curious to hear how it went!

i went yesterday for my 12 week visit. we heard the baby's heartbeat! it was 160. the OB said she was really happy with that.

today i told my principal about my pregnancy. she was really supportive and gave me some numbers to call about maternity leave. the school system offers no maternity benefits, and will only let you take leave under FMLA. i can use my sick days (i'll need 30 to take 6 weeks off), but I only have 25 and don't want to deplete all of them in case the kiddo has a doctor visit or gets sick and i need to take off. luckily, i signed up for aflac a couple of years ago. they'll pay me $1,700 a month (6 or 8 weeks) regardless of if i'm receiving sick pay or not. so, it looks like i'll be able to take most but not all of my sick days, and that the aflac money will compensate for the weeks i have to take loss of pay.

the pictures are really cute, fiddler and blanche! you guys look great.

beck- i'm not really showing yet either. i was a size 16 when i got pregnant, so i don't expect it to be noticeable on me for a while. right now one or two pairs of my pants are tight, and i'm wearing the rubber band in the button hole trick. my underwear are all rolling down, though, so i need to get some of those, and probably a new bra.

when did you guys need new undergarments?
pink, great that you had a good doc's visit! i needed new bras quite early, even though i wasn't a whole cup size bigger my band size went up. i got a couple of new underwire bras at about 10 weeks, but now underwires aren't so comfortable, I got some more recently at 15 weeks, this time soft cup ones and sports bras that should stretch as i grow. My underwear are ok, maybe because i wear really low thongs, which can't really roll down. i was a UK 12 to start with (US 8) so while i wasn't exactly skinny, the bump is definitely showing, but it could easily be mistaken for Easter egg weight gain smile.gif - in fact, some of it probably is...
Hello baby bumps! You are all gorgeous!

Went to first doc appt yesterday with the boy. It was pretty mellow, lots of medical history and discussion of medical procedures. They made me do a sterile Urine test which was.....IMPOSSIBLE. Three alcohol towlettes and a cup. The directions were something like, hold the labia away from the urethra, wipe one lip front to back, with a second towlette wipe the other in the same fashion, finally with the third, wipe the urethra. DO NOT OPEN cup until ready to pee in cup. Hi, I have two hands not three, which it would seem one needs for this procedure. I ended up peeing all over the floor due to the odd stance, the pressure of the pee and the hysterical giggling.

The doctor was really cool. He reminded me of Robert Carradine from Revenge of the Nerds without the odd laugh. Because I joked about wanting one pregnancy and two kids, he brought in the mini sonogram machine (he was curious...which is what I like about him, he seems to be just as excited about the journey as me!). There is one baby, so I'm officially pregnant. He saw the heart beat, I saw a bunch of black and white pixels.

We decided to go for the amnio. That is scheduled for week 15..I think. The boy and I have decided to keep things on the DL until we get the results. We are both intellectually agreed that we would likely terminate if there were major genetic issues. Wow, writing that is very heavy.

Blah Blah Blah, I'm a talker. There is more but I have to get going and I'm sure you are all tired of reading. Have a great day. Spring has officially sprung in Seattle which means it is raining...but it's a dry rain.
oh would you look at that? girl, i am LOVING that sexy mama pose!

thanks a lot guys, now i want to be pregnant again too!

15 days before the big day

here's one of me picking up little from the school bus the day our baby girl was born. yes, i am in labour. no, it doesn't have to hurt wink.gif . it was awesome.

pepper you look hot and i love the bikini.

kelly, glad the doc was a success. do you get offered screening tests to determine your risk for downs and stuff? i had a 5 part test that looks at various factors (bloods and detailed scan) to see whether there are certain markers - as well as the thickness of the nuchal fold, absence of a nasal bone was one, and something about the heart chambers, and the blood flow through the bladder (i think, although i admit i was not giving it my full attention). Once they factored those results in, the risk dropped dramatically from that based just on my age (i think i started with 1:800 and it went down to 1:28,000, and 1:49,000 for trisomy 13). (Sorry if you know all this already, provision here seems to vary in different areas - my SIL wasn't offered any of those tests at all).

i am trying geisha balls as an alternative to boring old kegels, i'll keep you all posted...wink.gif

threw up again yesterday morning - i've realised that it seems to happen if i drink too much before eating something - i'd had a glass of juice then made breakfast, but i think all that liquid on an empty stomach sets me off. In the week, I'm eating cereal and milk for breakfast without anything to drink, and having a big glass of water once I get to work - seems to be working for me. Just thought I'd mention it in case it was useful for others.
Blanch, sorry to hear about your mom and aunt, that just sucks. What a way to bring a great event down. I hope you are enjoying the nesting. How far are you again? Sounds like soon.

Beck, I'm familiar with some of what you were talking about. The doc offered the blood test and what not, but because all of that gives you only the probability of occurrence and because I'm a total science nerd, I want to know precisely what is going on genetically which leaves me with the amnio. I'm 39, so i'm in the higher risk catagory.

I'm totally freaked about the needle, so I've been working on visualizing it and relaxing. Has anyone had one? Does it hurt?

hope everyone is growing well!
yeah, that makes sense kelly, i guess the additional tests help to weigh up whether it's worth having an amnio, but like you say, they can't tell you for sure. i only really went for them because if i'd turned them down, i wouldn't have got a 12 week scan, and after the m/c i really wanted the reassurance of knowing there was truly a baby in there!

I got my bloods back from the hospital, all fine apart from they mislabelled two of them and so i have to go back for a retest. the thing is, the ones they messed up are for sickle cell and thalassemia (sp?). Bf and I are both white, Northern European, our gene pool is barely ankle-deep, and so the odds of me carrying either of those is so tiny, i can't really be arsed to go back for a re-run...The rest of my care is at a local medical centre, yay! I hope not to set foot in a hospital for the rest of my pregnancy.

blanche, glad the shower was good apart from the mom and aunt...are they always like that? Poor you ((hugs))

I was 39 when I got pregnant, 40 when I had the baby, so I understand your concerns. I decided I was fine with a nuchal fold test and the other stuff that beck mentioned, and didn't want to take the risk of an amnio. Like you I would have terminated if I wsa going to have a child with major genetic issues.

Nothing I can say about the procedure as I didn't have it, but good luck with it all. I just wanted to say I can understand your concerns.

Beck, was that part of your NHS care? I had it, but I had to pay for it privately in my area. I did it because of my concerns because of my age. I felt much reassured by the results and could relax a lot more for the rest of the pregnancy.

Blanche, that sucks. How totally inappropriate. I'm glad there was good stuff to make up for it.
anoush, I can't tell you how comforting it is to hear that someone else feels the same way regarding the genetic issues. Sometimes I post and the silence is deafening. It's a very intense thing to consider. I hope I don't have to make the decision at all.

Just an FYI I too will be 40 when I deliver. How was your experience? Was this your first? How old is he/she?
While I decided not to have the amnio it was something I thought through very carefully and thought about a whole lot in the early pregnancy. It was why we decided to do the private pay nuchal fold, etc, screening in spite of the cost (and my aversion to those going for private care when there is universal coverage.) We were in the process of moving to the US from the UK and money was tight, but it was worth it to us, especially me, because of the worry I felt.

At the best of times a kid with special needs is difficult. With our ages (my partner is almost 52 now, 50 when the baby was born and has a very physically demanding job), our financial situation and so much more we just felt we couldn't manage a kid with down syndrome or the like. I also have a history of depression. It's pretty well controlled now and I'm good at managing it, but part of being good at managing it is knowing that I don't think I could manage a special needs kid without serious risk to my own health (which then would impact on the kid's care.)

We tried for a long time to get pregnant, so it would ahve been very hard to terminate, but I know it's what we would have done as for us that would have been right.

Notbob is 17 months now and he is VERY energetic and dynamic. Ironic that I got the most intense kid I know when all the younger parents of our aquaintence got much more placid kids (still a challenge, of course, but definitely noticeable.)

I guess the thing for me that was a surprise was how FAST notbob was born. At my age, and it being a first pregnancy, I was much more worried about a prolonged labor than having a very short labor. In fact, it never, ever occured to me I'd have a very short labor. (it just occurs to me that some of you ahve heard this story so many times. Apologies for repetition.) I was worried about a possibly prolonged labor just in general because it seems so difficult, because I was so scared of having to have a c-section (though there is, of course, a place for a c-section in some cases, no question), and because first labors are usually longer and older moms can have somewhat longer labors than younger moms (tissue becomes less elastic with age, etc.)

Ha. HA! My early labor, for an hour or two was so mild I didn't know it was labor. It felt very like something else. (I swear, this isn't as stupid as it sounds, but fully explaining is another long story, so I won't get into it now. ) But I had no loss of mucus plug, no water breaking, nothing associated with labor in my mind. I even looked up signs of labor on the internet at the time (I'd woken about 3:30 am, not necessarily b/c of the labor, probably to pee, but after I was up for a bit I started to feel it) and thought "nope, none of those fit me." In hindsight the only thing that might have been a clue was a bit of looser than normal stool, but late pregnancy everything is kind of weird, so it didn't seem unusual to me.

I felt very, very localised twinges in the area of my bladder/cervix. (I thought it was bladder, but turned out to be cervix.) Nothing else at all.

We went to the hospital after calling the midwife and she said come on in. They examined me and after concerns from the nurse (unspoken until later so as not to worry me) found out that I did not have either a bladder infection or gall stones (the nurse's guess) but was in labor. By then it was a bit more intense, but still pretty manageable and I could talk through contractions, etc, so felt perfectly comfortable with the midwife's advice to go home and call her in a couple of hours. I really wanted to get out of the hospital and was just glad to leave. I called the doula and also said I'd call her back in a bit.

We got home and I decided I'd run a bath. I did that as soon as I got home and I swear as soon as I stepped into the bath, before I even sat down, I was hit by LABOR. HARD labor. Suddently it went from being mild to being so intense and fast I had a hard time getting my head around what was happening. Not to mention it suddenly REALLY HURT and that made it hard to think, and I was halfway down into the bath and found I couldn't get up or down, in spite of thinking to myself "oh, come on, how hard can it be? You can do it."

Finally I realized I couldnt' and yelled for help. Between my mother and my partner talking as they passed, they realized I was having contractions 1 1/2 minutes apart. Overhearing that finally helped me mentally get a grip on what was happening.

Anyway, they got me out, and onto the bed, and I said "Call [the doula] NOW. I want her NOW." I knew then we'd picked the right person because suddenly I wanted her more than anyone in the world other than my partner.

WE rushed back to the birth center, met by the midwife and the doula, and almost exactly two hours after we got there notbob was born. Entire labor, if I'm generous in my estimation, might have been 5 hours. Entire time I knew I was in labor--three at the most.

Everyone says "oh, how lucky" but it was very scary. I had no time to mentally get my head around the idea I was having a baby, hardly even time to catch my breath. I had no idea it wasn't going to be that intense or painful for hours and hours more (rather than only a couple more), though the midwife tried to reassure me. She was also great later as she said that she thought of that kind of labor as being like having a tiger by the tail and all you can do is hang on as hard as you can.

Also it meant that I had a bad tear as notbob pretty much came out in one big contraction. Another incredibly helpful thing that one of the midwives told me in follow up was that she'd had a fourth degree tear (the worst kind) with her first, and none at all with her second, and she remembered what it felt like to think you'd never heal, but you would. (Also, in spite of my fear of tearing I didnt' realize I had. In fact one of my first htoughts after the birth was "hey, I didn't even tear.")

Also I got sick of people telling me how lucky I was. I didnt' feel lucky, I felt fucking terrified. I am aware it's nice that I didnt' have a four day labor, but that doesn't mean a too short labor is great either.

I had very good care and in fact the birth went very well, in spite of the fact I was quite scared the whole time. The people aroudn me were supportive and loving and the environment of the birth center was lovely and comforting. The doula was the best choice I ever made in my life. Again, money was an issue with us, but she was so very worth every cent.

So in spite of my fears I had none of the problems that can be associated with age. I was worried about pre-eclampsia, prolonged labor, etc, etc, etc. I was fine. The baby was fine. He was given a bit of oxygen at birth but that was nothing to do with my age, I think.

I hope I haven't seemed to negative. I tell this story in part b/c I think it illustrates the idea of being prepared for EVERYTHING, including whatever you didn't prepare for. Also, that support is very, very important. For me, self talk was very important. Part of me kept thinking "I can't do this." For every "I can't" I said I made myself say--out loud--"I can". The latter was usually when the contraction subsided a bit (the former in the midst of it), and it helped. I felt like I needed to acknowledge the fear and the pain, but also to remind myself that i could and that my body was designed for this experience.

It's an amazing experience and knowing what I know now I kind of wish I could do it again.

Also, good for you all who are taking pictures. I avoided the camera for the most part during pregnancy and wish I hadn't been so silly now.

Novel done now.
blanche, your rellies sound like they can be utter knobs. wow, can't hold it together for your baby shower even eh? nice.
glad you got some good loot though, that is kinda fun!

kelly, anoush, it's hard to wrap my head around being faced with that kind of decision so i don't say anything. i'm not there, i've never been there, so i don't know what i'd do. i like to think i'd stick with the decision i've made intellectually about that but no one has ever said to me "your test results indicate down's" so what do i know? unless and until i walk that walk i ain't talking about it.
Holy Crap Anoushh! How incredibly intense. I haven't started researching the birth process, I'm still in denial, don't storks just drop them off on the door step? How scary to have it come on so quickly. I'm glad you were able to get back to the birthing center.

And the tearing. I haven't really thought about that yet either. I guess i just assumed that everyone tore, never thought there would be different levels of tearing. INTENSE.

Once we get through the next month I will begin the next phase of research.....umm does anyone know if there is a "green" disposable diaper option?
Hey, not everyone does tear. The lithotomy position is the worst for tearing (the one you see in the movies all the time, on back, feet in stirrups. That's for the doc's convenience, not your own well being.)

Squatting is good for reducing risk of tearing. Standing can increase it, but the midwife agreed as fast as he was born (one big push, basically. And it wasn't deliberate pushing but rather my body beyond all control pushing) it was pretty inevitable no matter what position I'd been in.

There are things you can do to reduce the risk/severity of tearing, such as supporting the head as it emerges, trying to keep it from happening too fast (most births have a bit more control over that than I did!), and warm compresses on the perineum being just a few.

I only mention the tearing because I was really freaked out about it and afraid it would really hurt. I didn't even notice it happened, however, and was convinced I hadn't torn at all post birth. Just thought that might be useful information.

I read a lot of birth stories and they helped me. I really like Ina May's Guide to Childbirth You may or may not relate to the language (rather dated in some cases--Ina May was/is a midwife on a commune) but she knows her stuff and is very affirming and supportive and it just really made me feel safer and more confident reading her book.

I have friends who've felt birth was incredibly empowering. One said that after the birth she felt she could climb a mountain. I didn't quite feel like that--more like "thank god that's over"--but I understood what she meant. I couldn't believe I'd just gotten through that. It seemed like the most amazing thing ever. I couldn't believe people were going about their business like it was all so normal when it was this incredible, transformative, undescribable experience.

I think the mantra for birth should be "I can do it!" How we all do it will vary from case to case, but you can do it (even when there are moments that you feel you can't. You can.)
Oh, we use Seventh Generation disposables. We werent' going to use disposables but we are. They aren't totally "green" of course, but they are chlorine free and they work great. That's something anyway.
ooh busy board, i like that smile.gif

kelly, pretty much what pepper said. i totally understand your decision but for me, the odds just didn't stack up - the screening showed a tiny risk of downs/trisomy 13, but the amnio had a much higher risk of m/c. if i was higher risk for downs on the basis of the screening, that would be a different set of numbers to think about. i also sort of think there are much worse things than downs that i would definitely have a termination for, but i'm undecided on downs specifically.

i also think that although maybe not all of us have had to grapple with the decision, you'd never be lacking support on here whatever happened.

anoussh, i got those tests on the NHS but i know my SIL didn't where she lives. i think it's because my nearest hospital is Kings, where they specialise in neonatal stuff (that Professor Kypros Nicolaides, you may have seen him on that documentary series about foetal medicine?)

i'm pretty sure there was a discussion on green disposables on the Green thread - flushables and compostables, although given the amount of sanitary products that end up on beaches and in the sea i'm a bit sceptical of the flushable option. Also worth bearing in mind that even if it's biodegradable it won't degrade all that fast if ends up double-wrapped in plastic rubbish bags on landfill sites. my friend uses these and likes them
annoush...thanks for the 2 mini shout outs in the birth story... from yee of 4-day labor and the absolute, 100% right place for the C-section. smile.gif

okey doke...back to reading and lurking. Having some "weird" feelings, but trying to not get excited, as could very easily be early pms. can't test for another week at least, though. I hate being paitent.

eta... on the diapers front. The 7th gen ones are less harsh, chemically...but in terms of overall green solutions... disposables and cloth come out about even. One...easy and disposable, thereby filling landfills. The other, slighltly more work (home economics of newborn/toddler life), no landfills, but more energy to produce and clean. Given those, we choose landfills. That, and moxette leaked right through the 7th gen ones when we tried them.
Oh, hell, yes, Mox. Of course there is a right place for a c-section.

I'd have been begging for the c-section after four days. Probably after two days. Maybe less. You must have been utterly exhausted.

Have you made any decisions about another c-section with another pregancy?

(Also, good luck!)

Was there every any indication as to why your labor with moxette was that long? Or was it just one of those things?

Interesting about the diapers. They were the only ones notbob didn't leak through. Maybe they are better for boys than girls? Also, no one told me you need to point the penis DOWN when diapering a newborn boy. (How was I to know? I don't have those parts, anyway and I just thought it might be uncomfortable because at first it naturally points up.) So he'd finally get to sleep and after 45 mintues he'd be awake, crying, with a soaked bed and soaked clothes. As much as I mentioned this in my family you'd think someone would have told me. "I thought you knew" they all said. No, I didn't, and we kept htinking we were hurting hte poor kid making the waist tighter and tighter.

He wasn't a lot better at sleeping when we got the diaper thing sorted out, but it helped some!

Another thought with disposables--they are more absorbant so you can use fewer and not compromise the baby's well being. Also, with notbob being a crappy sleeper it helped to have the disposables that could hold a TON of fluid before leaking/feeling wet. He wakes up enough as it is without having to change him all the time.
SOOOOO going for the scheduled C for any more deliveries. Seriously, its all about the evil you know vs. the evil you don't. Which is "worse?" tearing badly or incision healing? You have to point eh wee wee down, eh? Huh...never, ever would have known that, being a girl and having a daughter and all.

As to why it took that doc more or less had this to say: Most women are in early labor for WEEKS and don't know it. During that time, the hormones rev up really slowly, gradually, etc. With a "start from zero" induction like me, it may or may not work. Basically, my body simply did not respond beyond contracting to the pitocin. My docs are pretty "anti" c-section, but by the 4th day, we all agreed that it was time to call it. The pitocin was turned off early on the 4th day and my water was broken, but even that did nothing to move things along. By noon of the 4th day, I was all prepped for the c-section, but had to wait until about 5:30 pm for the actual surgury...couple of real emergencies took priority. Darned distressed babies! Through all of that, moxette did GREAT. That was a real reason why they kept waiting...i was "ok" and the baby was under no "stress". Kid didn't even cry when she was born. I think she saved it all for age 2.

I should have known moxette was a "take her time" sort of girl then!
flushable diapers here

i can't see how a section is any less painful or traumatic to the body though (than a tear), it's major abdominal surgery, they slice your stomach muscles through. that's gotta be painful and take a while to recover from.
what do i know though, i've never had either.

i didn't push, i didn't tear, i had no pain, i went shopping with the babies the day after they were born. meh, i am the girl you ask about an easy happy birth as i have little advice on the difficult kind. all the ladies in my family give birth like it's nothing though, we are a lucky bunch i think. i grew up thinking it was no big deal. maybe that has something to do with it too?
I forgot about you needing to be induced, Mox. I bet that is why.

And yeah, it sounds like you had great docs.

I've said for some time that notbob's birth was exactly reflective of his personality. Full force ahead at all times.

I think talking to your own mother and other close female relatives about their birth experiences can be really enlightening. I was a fast labor, but I disounted that as my mother's water broke about three days before and she kept resisting my father's entreties to go to the hospital (which was for the best, I think.) By the time he and the doc convinced her to go I was born in about an hour, I guess. But I was 6 weeks early and also it was clear to me that she'd been in labor some time, even if it wasn't very strong, so like Isaid, I discounted that.

My middle brother is adopted so no help there, and with my youngest she was given an epidural--without even asking her or without her permission!--and that can affect it so much I didn't think there was much to be learned there. (I would have gone back later and possibly killed someone if they'd done that to me.) In any case, it was fairly unremarkable in terms of time, etc.

As much as I usually won't shut up about "too many unnecessary c-sections" blah blah blah, I'm totally with you on the planned c-section for future. (For you, I mean, not for me. I'm not having any more!) I csn completely understand why you would want to go that route.

Yep, you have to point the weenie down. Who knew? I could have actually gotten ten or 15 minutes sleep here and there back then if someone had only told me.
The boy proposed last night!
congratulations! are you going for a big bump wedding or will you wait till afterwards? i thought about it but realised if i get married i want to be able to drink champagne all day ;-)
definitely post bump wedding. bad enough my big 4-0 will be dry.

i went to buy a birthing book last night. the first page i flipped to was picks of an uber mom pushing out a baby. can i just say OH MY FREAKING GOD! I wish we were more like kangaroos. push them out underdeveloped and small and then stick them in a pouch.....the smarter evolutionary path don't you agree?
the birth was the easy part. It's the taking care of them afterwards that I found so hard!
dunno, at least our way they are pretty tough once they're out! and much cuter
ok...weirdness continues. I'm bleeding, like a period, a full week before mRG is supposed to arrive. Thoughts? I'm mostly sure this isn't like implantation bleeding, cause i had that with moxette, but then again, i wasn't paying that much attention to it then.
that's strange moxie...i didn't have implantation bleeding but the timing sounds just right.

what i did find was that thinking about getting pregnant messed my (normally totally clockwork) cycle right up. But, it was always in the other direction, late rather than early.

just realised my last comment made no sense as it looks like a response to anoussh. i meant that a tiny kangaroo-type creature would be more nerve-racking to look after, and ugly.
congrats, kelly, on your engagement!

i have been busting out of all my pants and trying to line up child care for the baby next december. the centers are all around $200 per week, and the private home ones are a little cheaper. for a while i was pro center only, as i worked in that environment in college. but recently i found out that some of the moms and grandmas of the kids i teach actually care for children in their homes. i've been at my school for three years, so i've gotten to know the kids and some of the parents well. this may be an option for me.

i got two "congrats on your pregnancy" cards in the mail this week!

hope everyone is feeling good.
congrats on your engagement kelly! smile.gif

okay, i have a question - it's a bit of an anxiety question, but nevertheless, i'm a little worried and maybe just want some reassurance (but please be honest). i got pretty stressed out today at work - almost to the point of tears - in fact, had i not been trying to really fight them back, i totally would have bawled. i could feel my heart pounding, etc. i've only gotten like this one other time during the pregnancy, that i can remember. and i always worry about the baby. do periods like this - of high stress/heart pounding - harm the little one at all? i feel slightly silly asking this, but as i've said - i worry lots. i felt her moving around shortly after this little high stress period and have been feeling her off and on since - and no other negative symptoms (like bad cramping) as of yet. *sigh* and then on the way home from work i broke down and started crying because i was worried that my husband wasn't home yet (i couldn't reach him at home)...i thought the irrational stuff was supposed to go away about now? ha ha. thankfully he's okay and was just late arriving. anyway...

and sorry if this sounds petty or little - maybe some of you have had a lot more to deal with.

i don't know what else to write...but i hope everyone else is doing well!
lover, read this article... and then stop stressing over being stressed. smile.gif

you'll be fine. yes, protracted or traumatic stress can cause problems with a pregnancy, but your everyday common household variety of stress *might* actually be good.

during my pregnancy, we went through some terribly stressful times in the fj household (i made a bad call regarding a job change and wound up with an 80% cut in pay, while 3 months wasn't pretty) and jackaroo is just fine.

i'd advise you to just cry it out sooner next time - seems like that would be better than holding it in.

*waves* hi mamas!

*fingers crossed for moxie*
I agree 100% with FJ. And no, of course it's not silly being concerned about your baby (and yourself!)

I had a very difficult experience at about 7 weeks pregnant. We'd tried SO long and I was so scared of miscarrying (esp b/c at my age I didn't have a whole lot of chances left), and I'm just a worrier.

We were also in the process of moving back to the US (well, back for me, first time here for my partner.) I made what I thought would be a quick call to the housing trust to get another copy of a form I'd already been sent but misplaced in the chaos of moving. It was to transfer the tenancy of the flat to Martyn's kids, who already lived there, and now as adults could have it when we moved on.

Sparing you the boring details of council tenancy transfer I'll just say that 1) it was totally within the law and policy that that this was fine and 2) someone from the council had already confirmed that and sent me the form.

So what do I get but an arugmentative ignoramus who tells me that the tenancy can't be transfered and when we move the kids will have to find other accomodation and if they want council housing go on the wait list.

I ended up sobbing hysterically, and arguing with the fucker, who would not listen to me that I knew the law in this case (I'm a social worker, FFS.) I actually had to leave work b/c I could not stop crying. It took me about an hour to compose myself enough to be able to leave the building in a reasonable enough state, so I could hold it together in case a client saw me in the five minutes it would take me to get to my car.

Not only was I worried about making my partner's kids homeless b/c I wanted to return to the US (as if I didn't feel bad enough for "taking" him from them, but I was worried about the baby as well.

Of course, this was a friday so could I do anything to straighten it out? Of course not as all other venues were closed. I did get the local MP to look into it, and of course she basically said "I don't see what the big deal is--the kids can take over the tenancy." Duh. All that stress for nothing.

Plus, we moved continents with two cats, and moved in with my parents (at our ages of 40 and 50!) when pregnant. So yes, some stress.

Anyway, notbob is fine. Demanding, energetic, intense, but fine. And I have no doubt he would have been that way regardless of this or any other incident.

I think having a heightened sensitivity to anything that might harm the baby is totally normal. It's your way of being extra tuned in to anything that might be bad for mama or baby. Don't feel silly about it. I'd be worried about someone who never worried about anything when pregnant.
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