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"Host" as in, he's doing Tyra's job? With the same whispered, " model..."? Yeeeikes.

Not even curious about how they'll splurge with the big budget boost, ambercherry?

I'm not sure I'll be too busy to tune in, myself. The first "winner" is quite a lot less poised and graceful than I am, and inevitably looks like Ruth Buzzi (if you remember Ruth Buzzi) only skinny and much more wooden. It's just as well that she's decided to go "back to college" and leave the modeling life behind.
So, no.
I saw little bits of the UK one since I had to go -- well, wanted to go -- to a club opening. But I don't usually go out on Wednesday nights! Such fun it will be.

They were so much more hip and sophisticated in their appearance than the Americans were.
More varied as well. As chach has said, they seem to always have a screaming black woman. At least Eugenia didn't fit that particular stereotype. Then they had that almost mumsy/vintage looking girl. Interesting. Wish I had seen more.

London's been so cool since the 60s.

I like a lot of the women rockers like Exene or Patti Smith or Marianne Faithfull or L7 or Pink. It's interesting to see anyone who doesn't fit the mold who still has a successful career. Without being at all idealistic, or being a "resentful fat girl" , they truly could expand the notions of attractiveness with little sacrifice.

The whole reason for the super-skinny and tall thing is that it represents the classic art "heroic ideal' and the more prosaic reason is that they don't have to provide a bunch of sample sizes. Just one. If it's too big they can pin it in the back. Then, they put yellow make-up on people -- and orange-y hair tones ---because of the magazine printing process, in which the magenta is overwhelming and harder to manipulate.

So, like lemmings, we think REAL WOMEN should walk around being tall and skinny and yellow-orange. Not so much!

I will have to disagree that the girls looked so much more hip than the American contestants tend to. Lisa's hair was a mess, and Jennilee looked like a bad flashback to my middle school both in and out of hair and makeup (and I do not mean she looked retro; I mean she looked like a dumpy fifteen year old with no command of an eyeliner pencil). I thought their professional makeup was embarrassingly bad, and the hair was ... noncommittal at best. And the photos I saw were extraordinarily underwhelming. Not cool-like "real" or not-trying-too-hard, like most of ANTM's tend to be, but actually badly composed and really unattractive.

I did wonder about the nudity for a head shot myself.

I also wondered what in Maud's sweet name they were so excited about with those nudes. The last photos were all bad, Lisa's was merely less egregiously ill-lit, ill-composed, and unflattering than the other two. She did come out looking pretty in her pic, but the color balance was very muddy, and she didn't look like LISA. I found the fulsome praise inexplicable, and a little awkward.

Which brings me to the runway show. Dude, they got to walkin ARMANI. They got to wear, indeed, extraordinarily beautiful clothes. They had more than three people present - though the show appeared to be taking place in somebody's basement. And these things are never present for ANTM.

But I am sorry, both finalists had awkward and un-pretty body language. Lisa's walks, every time, appeared both lacking in direction and even simple inertia. She stumbled, every single time, halfway down the runway, short as it was, and never once managed to make it to the end, even after restarting. It actually had me longing for Bre and the Overstated Lippizaner Stallion Strut. Bad as the horse-walk ANTM so encourages is, at least it's performance, at least it acknowledges that models are paid to be looked at. Lisa and Edwina both appeared to be just sort of ... walking. Edwina did move that incredibly beautiful full-length evening dress, but frankly the cut on that thing was so phenomenal my dog coulda worked that shit.

I dunno. It was very, very interesting - but I had expected more sophistication than I felt I actually saw. And I didn't think the girls were particularly pretty/beautiful/edgy/striking.

Won't stop me from watching again next week (yep, it's coming back again apparently). But still. *Shrug*
Oh, well, I'll see soon enough!
....but frankly the cut on that thing was so phenomenal my dog coulda worked that shit.

And that is the difference between good design and that nonsense the ANTM girls wore on that rickety catwalk in the pool...and in the Gaudi park Ghost Bride debacle. There is no doubt Armani is a tailor--that's why the cut on all that clothing shown was phenomenal. As gangly as the models were, everything they had on fit--and moved--perfectly. As it should. The point of well made and designed clothing is that you could put it on a shlub like me and it would make the shlub factor much less of an issue.

Now, the US has some phenomenal designers too--but they never seem to make it to ANTM's closet.
I think the show's got a big problem with its sponsor--there's a difficulty for those manufacturers with high-end target markets in aligning themselves with ANTM, or Cover Girl (maybe CG and proctor and gamble affiliations might conflict with individual designers' licensing agreements). Anyway, the clothes are less than "nice" and they don't drape well or flatter, as a rule. How this helps an aspiring designer, I don't know.

Maimy, I didn't think the girls were so bad! I particularly liked how little BS the "Big" girl got, compared to the heaps someone like Anchal (who wasn't even big) got. Yeah, both knew they weren't gonna make it for Couture modelling--but Anchal sure was made to feel horrible about her body, which was tiny in comparison to the UK model's features.

All in all, the UK show had a really refreshing lack of sniping. Interesting how the models seemed to benefit in such a positive way from their involvement (the final two were confident, secure, happy! despite whatever outcome in the contest), in comparison to the way the US girls fared with their experience.
Any thoughts on the latest BNTM competition?

Whew, talk about out of context. Things were condensed to an almost ridiculous degree. But they don't seem to do the "Fear Factor" thing they were doing with the Americans. That can only be a plus.

1) M. Cha Cha yelled "Shut it, Sweetie!!!" in one of his Coronation Street faux accents, then declared that John Lydon should be one of the judges of the show;

2) What the hell was that Lianna woman ALWAYS crying about? She looks like Isabella Rossellini!

3) Neither one of those girls could walk on a catwalk, on nothing so challenging as heels and rosepetals, so what, exactly, are we doing?


4) This cycle's Presiding Model, Lisa Snowdon, showed a bit more similarity to Tyra in her matronly/girlfriendy attempts with the girls. Why is this motherly/psychologist bit deemed to be necessary?

But the crying was just too much. Every opportunity! Every elimination! And then at one point all the girls and Lisa Snowdon were crying together! If they put so much effort into condensing the hell out of the program, how could they have allowed almost 44 full minutes of weeping?

Generally the whole experience seems to be much less of a boot camp for the British girls than it is made to seem for the Americans. I gather it has a lot to do with the limitation of ego aggrandisement on the English show. No one seems to need to bully the girls or play mind-fuck games with them so much.

I love that everything the girls say has to be in subtitles. Ha ha!
ChaCha, WORD. The retrospective montages said it all: Abbey's was interesting, varied, energetic, showing a pretty girl and a lot of work. Lianna's: All Crying, All the Time. Oy GEVAULT. Pretty pictures, to be sure - I would say they were good (especially that last one in Morocco). But (a) she's ludicrously young, so she's got time for another shot; (b) she's terribly, terribly insecure; and © did I mention how much more appealing Abbey seemed, by comparison ... ? Ugh.

Not that I was particularly in love with Abbey. But I felt they went the wrong way with that one. And it was surprising. Telescoped and crammed in or not, it was clear enough even from what we saw, Lianna was not the strongest contender. Not by any definition of "strength"!

Interesting about the hostess, though - Lisa, you say? - she departed by far more than the first one, from last week, from the Tyra Banks School of Amusingly Overwrought Elocution. Hee. She didn't even use the stock phrases - at one point, it was something like, "Go you, you're still in" practically. That was a giggle.

The female judge with the medium length/medium color hair, with the harshest criticism, reminded me so much of a woman I work with, who is the most divine flatterer, and fantastically chic. Her mouth in particular reminded me of Mary. Very disorienting, especially with the personality difference!

Are they doing another one next week, before Beauty and the Geek premieres in two weeks? I didn't catch that ...
I don't remember another promotion for BNTM for next week; just a lot of ads about Beauty and the Geek, which is already driving the M. crazy (he's already employing the "duh" rule one of the Beauties talks about, whenever it's timely). So they may be taking a break...we'll have to tune it on Wednesday anyway and see what's going on. They're still looking for victims for CNTM up here, and I don't know when the next ANTM cycle will start.

It's odd, but the judges just seem to be far less bitchy on the British show all together. I don't think Crying Lianna would have lasted a minute with the shrewish harpy Tyra can become if you don't act at least 150% grateful for her critique. But that very critical judge who reminds you of your work mate--she just seemed so jarring because she vocalized her criticisms so harshly. I think she wouldn't have come off quite so mean if everyone else weren't quite so nice. Her personality was a striking contrast to good old Lisa's. Lisa was just so sweet natured!

Can you imagine what ANTM girls would pick out as a stylish, exotic outfit for Tyra, if they were let to run loose in a foreign marketplace? Hee.
Totally agreed, Chach.

Though I will stop and note the outfit Lisa did like was pretty hard on my sensibilities. Ah well. At least it wasn't - how did Tyra put it? - "big ole fake hair, lotsa makeup, and a dress cinched in at the waist!"

Any one else really excited for the new cycle???
I haven't seen anything about it... :::off to their website:::
I believe the next cycle starts 28 feb, though could be wrong, and the commericals I've seen imply "exotic and lush" w/ tyra looking intense saying "welcome to the jungle ladies.
Apparently there's two plus size models this season. I haven't decided how I feel about that yet. I do have the premier marked in my date book though...
Welcome to the Jungle. *snort!*

Imagine Axl as one of the judging panel.
Hee. Would he beat up Tommy Hilfiger?


I would so totally watch any reality show with Axl and Janice - and if it were fashion- or modeling-based, so much the better ...
A match made in the kind of hell those two like to call heaven, maimstress!!

I'd also like to see one or both of them on Saturday Night Live

Season Whatever (8?) starts tonight w/ a 2 hour premier at 8:00pm eastern time
Yay! ANTM goes against just about everything I stand for but

Damn you Tyra Banks!!! *shakes fist in the air* wacko.gif
OMG I can't wait. I'm so excited.
Hopefully it isn't as bad as last season.
totally. I'm the same way.
that's why I call it my crack tv. an addiction of the very worst, anti feminist form.

and did you notice that while tyra had made such a Big Deal out of having 2 Pluse Size (that's size 12-14.. the size of the Average American Woman) models in this cycle, only 1 of them made it thru the cuts tonight.

natasha needs to go.
her personality is way too trying too hard w/ the other girl's, but then she is just so/so in the shoots.
but then, she's already the drama-girl so we know she'll be around for awhile.

and sara, the blond w. the experience doing Everything. yawn. looks like cynthia nixon in sex in the city.
utterly booooooring!

my favorite part in "bootcamp", bc I am an Army wife, was those girls yaking and sqwawking about having to do ARMY stuff when they were on a MARINE Base. that was cracking me up bc there is a Huge Rivalry between the 2 branches.
- how hard is it to get something like that right? I mean, is editing Nothing to them?
That whole bootcamp thing was just not necessary.

But Miss Jay finally had something to contribute!
oh, i love it, i love it, i love it!! this show is seriously interfering with my intentions to do homework tonight. it really is a secret little crack addiction.

but from what i saw, they kept both plus size models...and got rid of kathleen. did you guys get two episodes tonight? i would be soooo jealous...

can't stand sara or natasha either. but i kinda dig jael, whitney, and felicia. tyra can take a hike too.

i fear this is going to become a wednesday night ritual for me.
Aren't the two plus sizes Dianna and Whitney? and they both made it through... Am I off base.

Tyra Banks just gets more and more ridiculous every season.

I like Jael.
yup, those are the ones. it makes me sad though, because i don't think they ever really have any intention of keeping the plus sizes around.

tyra's step-dancing and chant made me really uncomfortable. i wish they'd stop trying to top her past sillyness. i liked her so much more in the first couple of seasons.
you know what- you are Right- they DID keep both + size women- guess I was just projecting (forgetting what I had seen as to what I expected when they got down to the second girl towards the end of the cuts).
I'm sorry, my brain has ben short-circuiting lately! sad.gif

I like Jael's look but her voice and attitude are utterly boring and defeatist.

everything w/ her was a dramatic "... blah blah monontone blah blah flat nasal voice SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGH.

enough already. this is a prefect example of ( & please don't throw stones at me bc I say this to the mr ALL the time and he gets mad too)
shh honey, you're Pretty, don't talk.

and yah, tyra and the stepping.and what did that have to do w/ bootcamp anyway?
last time I hear, Stepping was Not one of the basic training exerecises.
I only got to watch the last half hour, it sounds like I missed some interesting parts though. I still could not believe the girl that they booted last night "fur is fine as long as the animal is dead" - wtf? What fur coats are made from live animals? *visions of a live mink coat* I liked that Twiggy spoke out against fur and the editors left her comment in.

I'm sure the girl they booted is totally sweet, but a brain trust she is not. I really could see how she would have to go - the industry would eat her alive.
I relished every moment of that episode, I really enjoy watching other people embarrass themselves. I could not believe some of the dumb-blond-esque things those girls were saying, Like that one girl with diarrhea of the mouth and her dead tarantula.

The whole already dead fur thing made me think of road kill couture.
When the girl who got booted responded to "We don't think you quite got it" with, "I know, right?" I almost could not believe they found this person out of all the women who competed to come on the show. It's not possible. Or is it?

Anyway, I kind of felt sorry for her when she lost, despite the lack of comprehension. A lot of those girls just didn't comprehend--they just didn't have it brought up for discussion (and they probably just would not have agreed so readily either).

I have serious difficulty with Jael and that other girl who has blonde hair but talks about how many shows she's already done and what a talented photographer she is. Whoever said "pretty girl--don't talk" said it all.

I actually managed to find a voice I hate more than Nicole's - Jael, with your nasal, half-drugged-sounding whine, COME ON DOWN. Oy.

I actually quite liked Kathleen. She kept reminding me of Bre with that wonderful little rough-edged voice, and hers was the only personality that really gelled in my head in the first hour. Very striking compared to many of the girls this season, and I was so dying to see what they'd do in a makeover.

Come to think of the makeover - she's probably 100% better off they didn't keep her. They'd have dyed her pee yellow. *Eye roll* Still. I was surprised they dumped her and kept Diana. I know, I know - the season of the Empowerment of the Real Woman's Body. But she was fairly dull, and her photo was flat-out bad.

Natasha is very sexy to look at, but what a "personality" ... Eesh. Plentiful competitors this go-round I can't even remember.

I thought the gothy, tattooed model (Michelina?) was absolutely exquisitely beautiful. I know she would not have been highly adaptable to different types of shoots, but that woman was gorgeous. I hope Gothic Beauty gets a load of her; she'd do extraordinarily well as an alternative model. I thought they might keep her, actually. The whole ad campaign leading up to this season has been all about "edgy" and "fierce", so I somehow thought they might, you know, actually cast people who were not quite so predictably in their usual mould.

Guess not ...
Come to think of the makeover - she's probably 100% better off they didn't keep her. They'd have dyed her pee yellow.

And the sad thing is, you know that of course, they would dye her pee yellow. I kinda liked her to.
Ahh, another season of Top Model.

First off, I can't stand Jael. Her voice is messed up and she just annoys me in general.

I thought it was interesting when one of the other contestants asked who the plus size girls where, it's kind of telling that they weren't even sure. I think they're both the smallest "plus size" girls the show has had so far.

I really liked Kathleen, I think that's the first time my favourite person has been kicked off in the first episode. I can't wait for the makeovers!
awwwww, there's no love for jael? granted, her tone is rather irritating. but i like her overall look. and i find it somewhat refreshing (even if she is a little overboard) that she's not all 'i'm a bitch, i'm the best, deal with it.' that said, i don't know if she's going to make it very far. i really have no idea as to who might win this one yet.
Jael's skin is pretty bad, on top of the sort of put-on "edge" and overwritten attitude. Most contestants on any reality TV seem to cast themselves with certain character traits, but something about Jael doesn't seem genuine. (Maybe it's the whole "I have a fever"/"I need to hula hoop some now" thing ... someone observed that she seemed to be covering her ass, and I tend to believe that.) I don't like people whose central pose is so likely to be only that, a pose.

Granted, we're talking about models - they've all got something to sell, as it were. I just don't like what Jael's hawking. The fake edgy thing has bored me for over a decade now, and it seems to find too much expression on both sides of the judging table at ANTM.
I forgot to mention that I loved that girl with the tattoos. I can't remember her name just yet but her face was so gorgeous, I can't believe they didn't pick her.
She was really pretty, and I wonder why they would have invited on to the show to "compete" just to cut her out before the whole shebang got started.

Yes, it's true, the tattoos would have severely limited her as a model--after all, she's committed to basically only one look. Models are supposed to be like plasticine--you're supposed to make of them whatever you need them to be, make them look like whatever image you need to create to sell your product. Anyone can hire a model and paint on whatever tattoos they like if they want a tattoo'd model--but doing the reverse is pricier than it has to be.

Maybe the exposure she got will send her on to the next place she needs to be. Who knows? We may be seeing more of her than we expected.
ok, so i just checked out episodes 1/2 and have some comments of my own to make.

first off, that chick who made it briefly last top modelseason, you know- the latino one, well, she TOTALLY looks anorexic to me. no longer is she the thin, grogeous latina, but now she is very angular, and weak looking in person. her prison guard photoshoot seemed to put more meat on her.

i think that mother who constantly mentions her son should be the next to go. what a royal bitch. she speaks to the other girls with too much superiority for a woman of age 20.

natasha? on my gawd. i can't stand her even more. i am pretty sure they are going to chop her hair off like sarah (this episodes/s sarah)'s hair. natasha is too attached her her hair and her attitude sux.

the tattooed chick who was booted off was hot. despite the tats (which aren't really appropriate for a top model), she had "the look" for sure.

hmmmmmmmmmm we'll have to see about the others... this is going to be an interesting season.
jael's voice irritated me too. argh.

i thought the tattooed woman was gorgeous.

i'm not totally fawning over anyone quite yet.

i can't wait for the make over epi. drama fo so'.
aw, I like jael. I also thought reneee was gorgeous, but ouch! what a bitch!

Natasha's almost too much of a bitch -- predictable.

Has anyone noticed on these shows that the ones that brag the most about the competition, this is a competition, I love to compete, I'm the baddest bitch competitor EVAR!!

always cop out half way through?
Natashalina Blondjolie won't get cropped, they'll probably curl her or do something with color - or even give her some extensions (as if her hair isn't overloaded with badly-achieved body as it is). She's too Bardot to cut her hair, even ANTM won't be able to do that.

Voice or no voice, bod or no bod, genuine or not genuine, Jael's skin is bad, and her "edge" is not as new as she or ANTM may want to think it is.

Whitney has amazingly beautiful skin. She glows.

Diana, I realize, came across badly in her photo, but her in-person presence is second to none so far. She presents herself very well in front of the judges, and seems to have a lot of life that she needs to learn how to translate to film. Good luck to her, I say!

I still find Kathleen infectious. Re-watching on Sunday, I was struck at the amount of praise her party shot (deservedly!!) received, juxtaposed against her being the first girl kicked out of the house. They simply made a mistake there. She was shown, through the political photo shoot, ASKING PEOPLE what her stance was supposed to be. Nobody really bothered to explain it to her. Nobody. And then they kick her off for not knowing what she was doing. She tried. At least two instances of her asking Jay and others on set what anti-fur meant went for naught. I demand a recount. Moron judges.

"Baby Tyra" is a cute girl, though I can't remember her name. One odd thing, though, that distracted me WILDLY through both the Wednesday and Sunday was that the skin around her brows was much lighter than everywhere else. And I don't mean the light hit the planes of her face and caused highlights. I mean that above and below, in a perfect penumbra around the hair of her brows, the skin was two shades lighter. And it wasn't makeup. I'm guessing brow-bleach gone awry ... ? I know proper beauty techniques, and good makeup, will cover this. But it just kept whamming me in the face every time she did a one-on-one with the camera. !!
Oi- that Natasha chick annoys the p*#* out of me too! mad.gif She is way too hyper and wanna-be know it all. I felt bad for her at first : mail-order bride and all- but she has got to go. But I agree with whoever said they'd keep her around for drama- like Jade (altho' she did have some fierce photos)
I like Jael. I can empathize with her "everyone like me" complex.
Kathleen was clueless- altho' her accent was really cool.
I hope the plus-sizes make it far- that would be cool. And yes- the latina chick from last season try-outs is Gross! i saw a photo of her and her waist is so small it looks like those corset-obsessed people who remove ribs etc. to get abnormally small waists (to each their own- just mho).
and tha Renee chick needs to just step-off. i am actually turned off that she could leave her infant son to do the show. i am all for working moms, but i can't imagine leaving either of my little bubbies for that amount of time w/no other contact than a nightly phone call...but maybe those are just my hormones speaking...
who will win? i have no clue.... they all seem pretty rough right now...
at least i have a show to follow again!! can't wait for the next project runway and top chef!
btw- anybody watch 'the agency' on vh1? have seen 1 episode- its pretty cool. like the janice dick. show but way less annoying!
i totally noticed that eyebrow lightness... coudlnt' figure out how she couldn't have noticed it herself and why she isn't trying to cover it up. what a distraction to her face.

i do sincerely hope that they don't keep renee on the show simply due to the fact aht she is "doing all of this for her boy". i mean serioiusly- if she cared so much about her son and family, then why in the hell is she pursuing a career which will take her far away from them on a regular basis? how is she doing this for "her son"? she is doing this only for her bitchy high-horse self.


and all i could think of today was how much i wish i would have been in that conversation when sarah was going on about her chanel modelling and nastasha was interupting her.... oh the carnage that would have ensued.

i also cannot wait for the makeover episode.

i wish cw television would also allow canadians to access their online re-run system.
I agree w/ everyone about kathleen. her personality was so funky & fun and Real.
I realy think they screwed up BIGTIME letting her go.

and during her anti-fur photoshoot I kept thinking cry kathleen CRY bc that would so have rocked the socks off ALL of them, a different but potentially Acurate, interpretation of that platform.
(disclaimer: I have been known to shout out my views of being anti-fur and so got really excited at seeing that.)

renee.. I don't know why, but I have a distinct feeling that she, maybe probably her husband too, are some sort of triathalete's or iron-man competitors or something.
she lives in HI, a place where those often take place, her body is Smokin', esp for just having had a baby, and if you really look at her, she's pretty muscular. and didnt' she say her husband was back in the states (off island) trying to get or raise money or something? I bet they are trying to get sponsors bc that crap is expensive to train & compete in, but the payoff can also be big.
I might be way Way off, but put it w/ her attitude and the pieces sort of come together.

natasha's hair is like a badly brushed out curly weave gone bad.
cut it. snip it. shave it and start all over please.

I also thought tatoo girl was hot, sort of reminded me of angelina jolie, and I hope she gets a lot of work in that alternative agency someone talked about. what a shame.

aside from kathleen, no one really stands out to me in a good (vs Annoying) way yet.
The lighter halo around Baby Tyra's eye brows isn't a bleach accident--it's chloasma. The skin seems lighter around the eyes and often the mouth, too, because the rest of the skin on the face is darkened because of hormones. This used to be called "the mask of pregnancy", and it would come on when a woman's hormones were out of whack as a result of pregnancy; if she went out into the sun or got even a bit of sun exposure, the affected skin would darken and the areas around the mouth and eyes would stay lighter, like a "mask". Basically the liver just can't handle the overload of hormones in the blood so this symptom arises.

Nowadays women get it if they've got asthma (and they use the steroids) or if they use the pill. But it can be hidden with make-up quite easily (but then it looks like the model's always wearing too much makeup). A good photographer can also shoot at angles that diminish the problem (though, sometimes, you really don't see the chloasma cause it's usually much more subtle--lights and cameras can actually bring it out so we all see it clearly).

I feel really sorry for the Natasha woman, she seems so clueless and so naive. I wonder if she entered the contest on her own accord, or if she was "entered" into the competition by her father-like husband. She seems to have a mildly porn-influenced idea of what a model should look like, and I'm not sure why. It's not like Russian girls have never seen fashion magazines before, or have never witnessed the same kind of media we have here.

Renee really shouldn't say much. Her silence would greatly improve her looks, to me anyway.
this is so crazi.

a old friend of mine who is divorced, mentioned that her kids have informed her that Daddy is actively persuing a Russian (e)Mail Order Bride. saving up to both go over there and see her and then bring her back here apparently... and yes he Is old and Creepy and if he thinks she's not just using him for American Citizenship and esp once she see's how rundown his house is and that he has no money, she'll dump him for a younger, better looking soldier (of which there are Oodles of around here), he's dillusional.

- maybe natasha has a twin back home?

seriously though, I know to me, her whole thing reeks of that cable movie w/ mira sorvino human trafficking.
Well, the whole mail order bride thing IS human trafficking. It's the 21st century's version of white slavery, and if women aren't selling themselves out of poverty to get to a wealthy nation, then some man with a lot of criminal connections will sell girls in bulk, himself, and cash in. This is nothing new: all of this started with filipina and thai women who were being plowed off their lands and forced into prostitution; the Phillipines in the 80's, the thai women a little later, then Russian women after Glasnost, and the "fall" of communism. So Natasha's just one of millions of women hoping to trade their bodies for a chance to start over in a country where they may not suffer from economic despair.

I wouldn't want to judge her for that, to me it seems like you don't have a lot of choice in such situations. Same with a lot of strippers who end up coming to Canada--once in a while you hear about groups of Russian teenagers who've been "sold" to strip club owners cause they need to pay off a debt to whoever shipped them over here. Seems to me that if you've got the means to sell yourself to a man who thinks he's buying a lovely, young, and subservient girl for a wife, you're at least in a much more powerful place than the alternative.

But it would still suck abominably if Natasha's hubby was the one who put her in the contest. It gives Pimping a whole other dimension to explore, doesn't it?
QUOTE(chachaheels @ Mar 7 2007, 09:35 AM) *

Well, the whole mail order bride thing IS human trafficking. It's the 21st century's version of white slavery, and if women aren't selling themselves out of poverty to get to a wealthy nation, then some man with a lot of criminal connections will sell girls in bulk, himself, and cash in. This is nothing new: all of this started with filipina and thai women who were being plowed off their lands and forced into prostitution; the Phillipines in the 80's, the thai women a little later, then Russian women after Glasnost, and the "fall" of communism. So Natasha's just one of millions of women hoping to trade their bodies for a chance to start over in a country where they may not suffer from economic despair.
I wouldn't want to judge her for that, to me it seems like you don't have a lot of choice in such situations. Same with a lot of strippers who end up coming to Canada--once in a while you hear about groups of Russian teenagers who've been "sold" to strip club owners cause they need to pay off a debt to whoever shipped them over here. Seems to me that if you've got the means to sell yourself to a man who thinks he's buying a lovely, young, and subservient girl for a wife, you're at least in a much more powerful place than the alternative.

But it would still suck abominably if Natasha's hubby was the one who put her in the contest. It gives Pimping a whole other dimension to explore, doesn't it?

oh I agree Completely with you on that chacha, people don't realise that even in today's society, that is still rampant bc people will Always pray on others and in economically/politcally depressed places, women and children are still lowest on the food chain. it's sickening and barbaric.

I think what bugs me about natasha, aside from her intrinsic personality really probably truly being annyoying regardless of nationality, is, and this is going to sound harsh I realise, but, I don't Want to have to care about her in that way.
I don't want to worry that was indeed "sold off" ("voluntarily" or not) to come to the US.

that's not why I watch the show.
I don't call it my crack tv for no reason.

it's not that I'm heartless, bc gosh heaven's NO, but this is fluff tv.
in my regular every day world I will rally & fight and campaign for the rights of those in need but in the escapism of entertainment, I find myself resenting this intrusion.

= end of rant, I'm in a bad place today in my head and realise at this moment of hitting Add Reply I may not be my most rational.=
I completely understand that, Freckle, and to a large extent, I'm wondering why this "story" made it into the ranks.

I mean, if you're not part of the solution in such cases, you can be a big part of the problem. I wonder what ANTM is saying, intentionally or unintentionally, by choosing Natasha as a contestant. To me it's more than just "a human interest story", or another example of the underdog having a chance to make good. There's something else at work here and I can't quite put my finger on it yet.

And that's why it's my crack TV too. I don't want to have to think about such things, and yet there they are.
And I can't just ignore the fact that there are so many young Russian girls on the runways, too.

Anywho, I wish we didn't have to think about this at all, and the story weren't in this cycle whatsoever.
Chacha, you fox - thank you for the "diagnosis" there. *Grin*

Freckle, I agree with you too. The worry impedes the willing suspension of disbelief. The whole point of Reality TV is that it should never, ever, in the slightest way, resemble any actuall possible reality, ever. Remotely.


Okay, double-post.

WHAT was that walk they *praised* (??!!?) for Brittney there? I mean, apart from gawky, gawky, gawky ... And she won the challenge???? Huh??

WHAT was Sarah doing pretending that flashing an audience of higschoolers and their PARENTS was nothing to be concerned about??

I liked Jaslene's walk. I'm starting to like her personality.
renee is just a BITCH.
reach into the tv and sock the snot out of her bitch.
I really can't believe that panel didn't see or call her for the way she was so Openly laughing at jaslene when they critiqed her. I didn't think renee's pictures were very pretty tonight, and man oh man did she whine about everything!!!!

but she made jael sound better! lol and really, I liked her and several of them much more tonight than last week. brittany doesn't have much personality and sort of blends into the background and seems very Young in person and at panel, but her picures were very Vogue to me. as early as it is for this.. I'm going to put the early money on her for the win as a sleeper.
most of what made jaslene's photo so "spectacular" was her makeup effects and accessories. there wasn't a lot of posing besides sort of hunching over and as she was behind/under a bleacher, sort of a given.

and yah, for my confession of the recap: I found myself feeling sorry for natasha <here's my crow as I shovel it in> bc I do think she's trying but is just utterly CLUELESS as to what most of the direction actually means. we've seen orange j go to such extreme legnths to direct other girls, why can't he do that for her too? I still don't like her hair though.
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