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Dina's mom
And one more thing, Mr. Pugs, no I was NOT looking for a pat on the back, I was really hoping to look for someone with a similar situation perhaps. Damn, can't someone at least understand just a LITTLE bit? I mean yes, what I did was terrible, can't anyone get that throught their heads that I REALIZE THAT????

Why is it everyone else is understood but me?? I mean, do I speak a different language?? Am I THAT vague?? I poured my heart out and I get kicked around? I would have just thrown myself into a busy highway if I wanted to get run over and smacked around!!!

I'm not looking for a pat on the back, and yes, I have to accept that there will be differences of opinion, and ok, ok, my rants were uncalled for, but that last paragraph that LoveMyPugs wrote was so high school!!! Gossiping about someone's freakin' POST???

Give me a damn break. And find something ELSE more earth-shaking to talk about than someone's damn post-that's so immature.

Please. rolleyes.gif
Dina's mom
Also, I am not SAYING it's not my fault!!! JESUS CHRIST!!! I am not trying to rid myself of responsibiltiy for my freakin' actions-you READ my posts wrong!!!!

Well, enough, no one freakin' has it in there damn heads that I said, I FEEL TERRIBLE ABOUT THIS WHOLE DAMN THING!!!

WTF, do you want my god-damned BLOOD?????
Dina's mom
Culturehandy, I do wish to thank you for being at least a little more tactful in your post, I do appreciate that.
Dina's mom
You know, I"m not making this up, either, but I failed to mention that i"m with my boyfriend is NOT only because he loves my daughter and treats me like gold, I also stayed with him because:

a. He's funny
b. We can talk about practically ANYTHING and have great laughs
c. We love the same things and have almost the same hobbies
d. We have the same taste in music
e. He's very easygoing and not the jealous type, which I love that about him
f. He's a blast to be with!

I do realize, now, that my first post came across as extremely shallow and inconsiderate and I really had no intentions of coming across that way. I was as honest as possible and failed to mention these other wonderful traits he has. I do understand that looks aren't everything. I suppose I"m very used to being so attracted to men that treated me like a second-class citizen while I was so into them-perhaps a subconcious attraction due to the fact that I don't love myself, so, naturally, I pined after the ones that treated me as such. So, whenever I man falls all over me, I end up "pulling away" mentally-because, well, he loves ME, and I don't love myself, so it's a vicious pattern. It's been said that you can't love others unless you love yourself first, and I know that's the root of all my dilemma's.

Now if you wish to still say I'm trying to find excuses for any responsibility for my actions, well, I'm sorry, then that's your problem, because I"m only stating the facts!!! I'm just being sincere and honest and if no one wants to see that, well, then I don't know what else to say. I'm just trying to say that my reactions and rants were uncalled for and my original post was selfish.

i just wanted to thank "dinas mom" for making me laugh for a good 10 minutes.

is it hot in here or is it just me?
Dinam it seems to me that there is one thing that is missing from what you are saying.

Not once have I read that you love him.

I'm relurking now, I don't even date!

it's true..... we are all listening.

Dina's Mom- calm down, stick around a little bit, and you'll get to know the character of the peope you've asked for advice. The Pugs aren't lashing out at you!! what they've said is in complete consistancy with their long history of posting on BUST, so if you would look around a little bit through the archives, you wouldn't be surprised about the advice you've recieved.

LoveMyPugs and Mr. Pugs- i think you two have the sweetest relationship ever- I really admire your honesty- and I think you are perfectly alright to be saying what you've said.

And I'm going to second it- Dina's Mom- you aren't into the guy, get out of the relationship. You seem to think you deserve someone who treats you like gold AND you find attractive. That takes time. So don't jump into relationships that make you feel this guilty. Look after yourself and your little family and the rest will straighten itself out. We can't tell you to magically be attracted to the guy who treats you like gold if you're not attracted to him, and you seem to say that's the only problem in the relationship, and it certainly is a big problem.
Mr Pugs
Thank you all for the kind words and now we're known as "The Pugs" lol...

It seems you have a bit of shoelace stuck in your teeth Dina's mom. Kinda hard to pull your foot out of your mouth when the posts are there to be re-read. Anywho, you will do what you want to do, all I can add as a non-cheating male in a relationship of over 11 years is take a breather and do a little self assessment. You need to be happy with yourself before you can be happy with someone else. In all sincerity, therapy seems like a good choice. I'm sorry you feel like you are getting ganged up on, but you did post on a public forum that you have no idea who sees or posts here. LoveMyPugs wasn't gossiping about your post, as I post in here as well and would've seen it anyway. We just try to give advice to those who want/ask for it, sorry you didn't like the answers you got.

Dina's mom
Thanks so much, glassK, for being one of the ONLY ones that seem to understand where I"m coming from. And I'm very happy that I could make some people laugh for 10 minutes (you know who you are).

Yes, I do wish to apologize again for the name-calling rants, they really were uncalled for and I realize that "LoveMyPugs" wasn't calling me names outwardly, so I had no right to say the things I said. But it seems no one else can understand that and say that I have shoelace stuck in my teeth-whatever. Yeah, I supposedly am trying to shun all responsibility for actions one moment, then when I sincerely DO take responsibility for my actions on the threads that were severly uncalled for, all of a sudden, I'm sticking my foot in my mouth???? I give up-I just wish to say thanks to you again, glassk, and Culturehandy for being more tactful, but this is the absolute last time I'm coming on to this site. Yes, I do realize there are different points of view, but I feel even worse now that I"ve aired out my situation. I should have just stuck with talking this over with my trusted friends and family-YES, people, I DO have friends-gasp!!! Shocking, isn't it????

Anway, thanks for all the input, you won't be hearing from me anymore.
Coincidentally, there's an Ask Metafilter thread today on a similar topic: "bf is everything I could ask for but I'm not sexually attracted to him"

Answers include a recommendation for the book How To Dump A Guy (A Coward's Manual). (Dina's Mom, if you're still reading, the "coward" part is NOT directed at you. I just think it's a funny title. Looks like a good book, too, from the reviews.)
I say I always wonder what's going on when someone's emotional intensity doesn't match the situation. Dina's mom, I hope you figure your situation out so you don't feel so guilty and unhappy.
"I always wonder what's going on when someone's emotional intensity doesn't match the situation." Me too... but at the same time, earlier this year I learned a valuable lesson about how people come accross online when my sister started going to an online forum for the first time in her life, seeking technical info about something.

She got trolled quite badly and told me all about it and about her bewildered replies so I went to take a look, and was quite surprised. The way she "sounds" online is ...intense... full of block caps, multiple exclamation marks and comments that I'd normally interpret as snarky (stuff like if you can't give me constructive feedback could you consider not replying to my posts) but the bizarre thing is because I know her, I know that she didn't mean to shout and she was quite mystified by the whole thing and by the replies she was getting. She basically doesn't know how to translate her speaking tone or intentions into writing.

Not that I think this is necessarily what happened here, but it just reminded me of it.

/off topic musing
I think you make a good point venetia. As has been said before, the tone of a post can be (sometimes wildly) misconstrued, particularly if the poster is new to a forum. Personally, while I think dina's mom's follow-up posts were abusive and unnecessary, I also feel she was immediately jumped on, in a way I find alienating and non-inclusive. She's not the first person on these boards to have made a mistake in her personal life.

/two cents
QUOTE(LoveMyPugs @ Sep 20 2007, 04:01 AM) *
Dina - I really don't know how to say this without sounding terrible but you sound awful. I have to stick up for the nice guy who treats you like gold but isn't "sexy" as you call it. I find a guy who treats me like gold and respects me to be attractive. I mean how can you stay with and have sex with someone for over a year who you don't find sexually attractive. Then to think about cheating? That's terrible. I feel sorry for him and worried about the emotional blow he faces when you finally are honest with him. I'm really sorry to be so hardcore but your post sounds very shallow. Maybe I'm just not understanding your situation completely but from what I read all I can say to you is looks aren't everything and if you decide to leave him let him down gently.

I gotta call foul, Pugs. You were very harsh and judgemental to this person, and I think it was unnecessary and completely unwaranted.

You never called her a "bad person" per se, but you sure did insinuate it.

Sexual attraction is a tricky and complicated thing. What Dina is going through is not uncommon and not once in her post did I get the impression she was looking for validation.

Doesn't the fact that he obviously loves you and your little girl count for anything in your mind? I think you have some serious self esteem issues. Maybe the fact that you have such a poor opinion of your own looks makes it easier for you to treat someone who isn't "sexy" so poorly. In a world that is so focused on looks we have women and men like you who don't know a good thing when they have it sitting right in front of them. God, when you dump him don't tell him the truth okay!! I'm really sorry to be such an asshole but shit like this just pisses me off. So called "unattractive" people don't have enough shit to put up with on this fucking planet without having to have their hearts broken by people they think love them but have just been lying and bullshitting them all along. Fucking hell!

If you read her post, you can tell that she has been trying to be into this guy because he is so good to her and her little girl. Also, because she is not attracted to him, doesn't mean he is "unattractive" or ugly, so stop projecting that onto her. Plus, who are you to judge anyone? Just because someone is nice to you and good to you, does not make them "right" for you. I agree that this woman has some severe self esteem issues, and she needs to work through them. Being as it may, maybe that is a tip that she needs to not be with anyone and work on herself?

You reaction to her post was quite menacing and bullying. This is why I rarely post here anymore. If you do not agree with the more agressive poster, it turns into all out flame war.

To make value judgements on people over the internet when it comes to their love life is uncalled for, and you should know better than that, Pugs. Affairs of the heart are tricky and messy. She is dealing with guilt and self esteem issues and she is reaching out for advice, not for more people to make her feel shittier than she already does. Bad form.

Though, I do agree that her responses to Pugs were a bit rattled and she could use a lesson on using the quote button, but, being new here and having a response like that, I think her reaction was normal. You were pretty darn brutal.

dina's mom, i think i understand where you are coming. although i am not in your or never been in your situation. i have met men that are nice, but i'm not sexually attractive to them. and sometimes what we want and desire the most, turns out that we do not want that in the end. i believe that you do love your bf, but it sounds like you are not IN love with him. towards the end of my previous longterm relationship...i was not sexually attracted to my ex. i loved her, but i was not in love with her. and vice versa. we were staying together to be safe. and it is a big risk to leave a safe relationship. especially if you have a child. there are so many movies that addressed this point. do you feel he is passionate about you? i'm wonderin' if he maybe feelin' the same way too. of course, i could totally be off base here. i hope you keep posting in here.

and if any more ranting needs to be handled, then there is the "take it outside thread." it was started for a reason...

sassy, there is a big vulnerability when intimacy happens and your relationship is going on a deeper level...deeper than any other relationship. mcgeek is a good man and i'm sure it feels scary. and he sounds so understanding. i know many women....myself included....who are going through the same thing...
sassy, moving in is a huge step. any step that size often comes with trepidation. even when you know someone really well it is always different to live with someone. you can stay with someone for an extended period of time and it would still be different to move in with them. when i moved in with my hubby it took us alot of getting used to. just the everyday stuff was suddenly different and shinyboy and i had been staying with him frequently and for extended time periods but to move in totally ment that i no longer had a place to go to outside on 'his' home. it took a while to make it 'our' home. having your own place gives you some security if things don't pan out, but in all good relationships you have to take chances. it sounds like your honey is worth the chance. good luck.

as for the two pages of clashing posts all i can say is . . . wow. and pugs, although i agree with much of what you said, i have to disagree with the idea that one must feel guilt when a wrong deed is done. i personally feel that feeling guilty does not acomplish anything. i have made some monumental mistakes at life and with relationships but i do not regret my mistakes of feel guilty. i recognize then as wrong and then i make an attempt to learn from them rather then feeling guilty. i feel that guilt is used to beat oneself or someone else up and then that is the focus, the guilt, rather than the fact that 'yes something was done that was wrong, now what can be done to remedy/improve the situation and what can be learned from it. - just my thoughts, guess i had more to say than just wow.
Thanks for all the advice. Actually, Ms. Pugs idea wasn't far off. We're decorating the basement (painting, figuring out where my stuff is going, many trips to IKEA) and I've found it's bringing us closer. It's also helping with the jitters. I cancel my lease in a week. I really loved my apartment, but I just can't afford it. Especially with not having a job. However, I think the basement/playroom will end up being "my space."

advice to a friend is different than advice here on the boards, especially to a new person. a friend takes it knowing where it's coming from; your particular situation and personality and all. s/he wouldn't be asking for it if s/he didn't trust it. but around here, i see both sides.... we need to tread a little more lightly, maybe give some background info, etc. but also when asking for advice, we're putting ourselves out there a bit more and gotta expect all sorts of responses, even ones we may not like.

and in a LTR, i get both, people asking for advice and people telling me what to do!
I'm really just venting here, so eh.

I just found out that I got into the musical at college. The catch is that at some point during the show I'll be wearing just a bra and underwear and simulating sex with another actor. I just told M about it, and he wasn't entirely comfortable with the idea at first, but I kind of convinced him that it was going to be all right by saying that I've worn a bikini before, which amounts to the same thing, and that the other actor is a girl. Here's the thing: That's actually a really crappy rationalization, because I suspect that I'm bi. I suppose I should actually tell him this, and explain that the real reason it doesn't matter is that I don't think about anyone besides him in that way at all, regardless of gender. But I'm kind of chicken. Also, I would want to tell him in person, and I won't actually be seeing him for three more weeks. *sigh*
Mr Pugs
QUOTE(starkitty @ Oct 1 2007, 12:55 PM) *
I'm really just venting here, so eh.

I just found out that I got into the musical at college. The catch is that at some point during the show I'll be wearing just a bra and underwear and simulating sex with another actor. I just told M about it, and he wasn't entirely comfortable with the idea at first, but I kind of convinced him that it was going to be all right by saying that I've worn a bikini before, which amounts to the same thing, and that the other actor is a girl. Here's the thing: That's actually a really crappy rationalization, because I suspect that I'm bi. I suppose I should actually tell him this, and explain that the real reason it doesn't matter is that I don't think about anyone besides him in that way at all, regardless of gender. But I'm kind of chicken. Also, I would want to tell him in person, and I won't actually be seeing him for three more weeks. *sigh*

My understanding is that you guys are in a LDR or going to different schools, so from a male point of view, um...I'd hit him with that bit of information after the show. If you tell him now, it's just one more thing for him to worry about. Also, you are acting in a play, not really having sex with the girl. I agree it would be important that when you tell him this, you do it in person. It's easier to believe someone when you are looking them in the eye, and you don't want him to doubt that you'll leave him for a woman. A busy man's mind can be a terrible thing when it comes to fears of losing your loved one and infidelity.
mr pugs, a busy womans mind is just as bad. as rational as i can be i still find that i am suspicious about what i know i should not be. i even had trust engraved into his wedding band because he is totally trust worthy. i am the one with the trust issues. for that reason i totally agree with you in waiting to talk face to face.
There's nothing wrong with telling him the "I don't think about anyone besides him in that way at all" bit now, is there? I can see why the bi part should wait, but that other bit sounds reassuring, to me.
That's exactly what I ended up doing. I told him that the gender of the person didn't matter, and that it's just a play, and that even in real life I'm not attracted to anyone but him. I don't actually feel the need the need to tell him I'm bi, because it's not an issue while I'm in a relationship with him. I mean, it's not like I hide it at all. For god's sake, I was talking about how hot Lauren Bacall was in the Big Sleep when we watched it together. So I think my conscience is clean, and that he feels fine about the whole thing now as well.
Jeez, my internet gets messed up for a while, and I go out of town for work, and when I come back the place is a mess. Yeesh.

Glad everything is working out ok rudderless. I'm glad my response to you wasn't construed as harsh -- I was worried about that after I posted. Jealousy is such a terrible, gnawing, destructive force, and it seems like so much hurt could be avoided by taking a step back and thinking clearly.

Starkitty -- congrats on the part! What musical is it?? I think you handled the situation perfectly. It IS "just a play" when all is said and done. If you develop feelings for your fellow actor, then it might become sticky. But that's a bridge you can cross when you come to it, and there's no reason to plant seeds of doubt really.
Starkitty, I think you handled it fine. What part is it again, in what play? I'm curious. Theatre buff that I am.

So, I decided not to move in Mcgeek until my lease is up. They wanted 2 months in rent as well as a deposit, and I just can't afford that right now. We did paint the basement at his house to have it become my space. However, I'm just not emotionally ready. I want to have my apartment as a safety net. I know that this doesn't sound as though I'm weak. It's just that the last time I moved in with someone, we fell apart. Besides, I only have 3 months left on the lease. They're going to deduce some money in January as well. I just have a lot of work on myself to deal with before I can make this big step.
It's an ensemble part in The Wild Party. I definitely wouldn't develop feelings for my fellow actor because of the play, though. I've been in theatre class to long to want to ever date other actors, lol. But seriously, I don't really think about anyone besides M.

Sassy-Good luck with McGeek! From what I've read of your posts, he seems like a great guy, but there's no reason you should force yourself to do anything you're seriously not ready to do.
slight hijack - but i believe i saw The Wild Party in NY on Broadway in 2001 :-)
QUOTE(p_176 @ Oct 4 2007, 03:18 PM) *
slight hijack - but i believe i saw The Wild Party in NY on Broadway in 2001 :-)

Yay, cool! I actually have only a really basic idea of what it's about right now, but I have the first meeting for it tomorrow.

RC-Good luck! I used to be so incredibly cynical before I met M, and I still get that way sometimes, even though we've been dating for a year and a half so far, and haven't even fought. We've had problems, of course, but it's been both of us working through them together. But even though it's such a great relationship, I still freak out when I can't see him for awhile, or when he takes longer than usual to call me back, even though it's for a good reason, etc. Basically, learning to completely rely on someone else to be trustworthy is really, really hard.
rutterlesschild, im sort of the same way im on such a mission to be independent and non trusting its really hard for me to be in a ltr. but in a sence i always have been. i was in a fairly open ltr for 8ish years and it ended in mistrust and me losing a ton of money and friends because of me putting my trust in him, now im in a committed relationship after telling myslef i would never go through that again, thinking that will always be the ending of a relationship. its hard for me to trust and live as 2, even though i have always done it, but for me its because i was wronged by someone i knew since i was old enough to date.

but on a more positive note, i found myself entering my relationship im in now (3 years and going strong) when i wasnt looking for a relationship, but when someone you know you can live your life with happens, you just have to roll with it, and its worth it.
hi all, i've been posting about my relationship mostly in the LDR thread, but i thought i would come over here and join the community. plus, i want to milk you for some wisdom since jealousy and honesty appear to be current issues.

this is kind of a double post, but i figure i'll retell the story and get everyone's perspective. here goes:

how i used BUST to inadvertantly fuck myself (and not in a good way)

about 8 months ago i was still living in costa rica, doing field work. i'd been there about a month, i suppose, and went out for a wild night at the beach. i ended up getting tipsy, going home with a tico guy and having the worst fuck of my life. so bad, in fact, that i posted about it in 'Your list...' in LTAS. i also posted my list, up to date, and admitted the fact that even though i know my number, i couldn't remember all the names to add up to it. sheesh.

at the time of 'the worst fuck ever' i'd been exchanging letters with my now boyfriend. we'd had this tryst back in august of last year and had kept communicating. i never expected it to go anywhere, but i found the letters to be moving, romantic, old fashioned, all the things i love. he came down to visit me in costa for two whole, glorious, fantastic weeks. we fell in love. we decided to be committed to one another. in the course of that time he asked me if i'd been with anyone else since our jaunt back in august....

and i lied.

in retrospect, probably not the smartest move on my part, but what's done is done. at the time it thought, what he doesn't know, can't hurt him, right? i used protection and the sex only lasted about 30 seconds, so it does't count, right? right? i have no shame over the rest of my sexual history, but this was one i wanted to erase and sweep under the rug.

flash forward many months. i'm online, posting in SBSG, he's looking over my shoulder. i shrug it off saying, 'ah this is just a feminist rag you wouldn't be interested in.' i let him read a couple of my boob-related posts and think nothing of it. i had completely forgotten about my 'list' posting. about a month later i call him and launch into some inane babbling about plane tickets and schedules, yadayadayada. he is completely silent. then says the dreaded, 'we need to talk.'

long story long, he had come onto bust and read my posts, ALL of them, including my entire list. i was stunned. first, overwhelmed by guilt that i had lied to him and then second overwhelmed by anger that he had come onto bust and read everything. words i never intended anyone, except for those in this community to see. despite the fact that this is a public forum, there is still a degree of anonymity, right? we weren't together when the bad fuck transpired, it's that i lied to him, that's his issue. but what bothers me more is that he's seen my ENTIRE sexual history, laid out in detail, ferocious detail. things i would never ever ever ever say to a significant other, but i'm glad to voice to a group of like-minded women. i know there are alot of evolved men out there who claim that a woman's sexual past doesn't matter to them, but, come on. no matter how enlightened he may portend, in the end, it's obvious it still bothers him.

it's been a huge issue ever since. he's incredibly jealous of any man that i mention, even in passing. it's cast a palor over all the deep conversations we have about our past and our future. i'm tainted. just the other night we were getting all serious and he asked if i'd ever thought about breaking up with him, which i never, ever have. he got all quiet again and told me that he'd seriously considered it. i knew why.

we've tried to work through it, and he makes a real effort not to bring it up and make me feel bad all over again (and he has definetly apologized for coming into the forum, realized he invaded my space, sworn to never come again, and if he does he'd better be prepared to be reading the words i'm typing right now) but it still finds a way to rear it's ugly head.

i feel awful, like a total shitbag, but i also can't keep being punished over and over again. either break up with me or forgive me, right? i don't know ladies, i just don't know, but my heart hurts. i'm not even sure if i'm asking for advice here, just thoughts, insights, whatever. and to the ladies in the LDR thread, sorry if you have to read this story again. your words definetly helped me alot and i appreciated them. i guess i'm trying to reach a wider audience.

thanks for listening, sorry for the verbose invasion.
Oh jeebus, DJ. That sucks, but this guy kind of sounds like a jerk. It really comes across as though he's playing the martyr, and enjoying it. I know it was a "lie," but let's be realistic, there's big lies and small lies. Yeah, you were wrong to lie about it, but really. You didn't cheat on him, you didn't like, steal his car or kill his dog or anything and lie about it later. You had a drunken one night stand you didn't tell him about. It sounds like he's just latching onto this one thing to make you feel shitty constantly. If he really loved you and wanted to have a relationship, he'd work through this WITH you, instead of bullying you with it months and months later. I mean, to threaten to break up with you about this definitely sounds like he's not that into having a real committed relationship that you have to work on.

And another thing. If he has a problem with how many people you've been with, that's his problem, not yours. I know again, being realistic, that it kind of sucks to think of your SO with someone else, but again, being realistic, your SO HAS been with other people, so suck it up.

And ANOTHER thing, to use this whole situation as justification for getting jealous of ANY other guy you mention is totally insane.

I hope you don't take all this the wrong way, but something about your post just makes me very ... wary of this dude. I know you're going to be all "no no he's really great it's just this one thing, really," but please go back and re-read that post you wrote -- think of it as though it was a friend of yours. It's just... there seems to be something not at all right going on...

ALSO, I hope he comes in here and reads these responses, snooping busybody that he is.
thanks rudderless, we are in an open dialogue and i really do think things are getting better. there is enough positive stuff about our relationship that it is worth working through. although i don't appreciate the invasion of privacy or the guilt trip, in the end, i think alot of the shame i feel about it is self-inflicted. i was feeling particularly vulnerable when i posted that. we'd had a rough conversation just a couple days before. things are looking up and i'm not going to do anything rash until i visit him this week. but thanks for the encouragement.

phobia, yeah..........i chalk up alot of it to his own inexperience in relationships. i'm going to try and not be 'that girl,' and say how perfect he is, but he isn't. things have been alot better lately, it was just a bad conversation we had last week that's been eating at me. and in all honesty, i think I might have the problem with my history. i mean, i was the one who wanted to cover it up, right? because even though i say i'm not ashamed, there must be some kind of guilt associated with that. and he did say, 'i don't care about your history, it's made you who you are. i love you, i accept you, i don't want you to ever feel like you have to lie to me.'

that being said, you make an excellent point about big lies and little lies and him being a martyr. like i said, i honestly don't think he's ever been in love before or had to deal with these kinds of serious emotions. but it don't want to get sucked into the game of defending him. there is alot of truth to what you are saying phobia and i will take it under advisement. snooping busybody. i secretly want to laugh at that. thanks for the tough love.

when all is said and done, i still am very much in love with him and willing to work things out, but if he can't get over this, you are both right, it is HIS issue, not mine, and if that's the case, it's put out or get out (pun intended).
"that being said, you make an excellent point about big lies and little lies and him being a martyr. like i said, i honestly don't think he's ever been in love before or had to deal with these kinds of serious emotions. but it don't want to get sucked into the game of defending him. there is alot of truth to what you are saying phobia and i will take it under advisement. snooping busybody. i secretly want to laugh at that. thanks for the tough love."

Yeah -- it reminds me a little of that episode of Friends (ok stick with me here!) where Chandler and Monica have their first Big Fight as a couple, and Chandler automatically thinks it means they're breaking up, but Monica knows that Big Fights are part of a relationship. Still, I really am getting squicked by the fact that he seems to be hanging onto this as a way to make you feel bad. Does he bring it up when you guys are arguing about other stuff, like as a way to throw the problem back on you? Or is it really just something you're carrying around and he's more over it than you think? Sounds like you need to take a deep breath and try to get some mental space on the issue? Hopefully seeing him will help clear up everything. These kinds of conversations are really stupid hard over the phone -- even worse over the interwebs.

Just FYI -- about a year or two into our relationship, I drunkenly hooked up with one of my girlfriends (ok, look, she looked like Xena and I had never kissed a girl before!), and boy was my boyfriend pissed. But we talked it through, figured out why I thought it was a good idea at the time (lack of communication about how monogamous we were and who we were allowed to fool around with or not), and got through it. We've been together 10 years at this point, and that wasn't even the worst thing we've gotten through. So it's possible to get past some ugly stuff. Hang in there and don't feel ashamed about your past! It made you who you are!

I just want to tell you that I admire your reaction when you were finally busted. that takes a loooot of guts. i have been in a similar situation, with my boyfriend of almost 4 years... and things are incredibly serious between us (as in, living together for more than a year and planning, in a not soon but definite way, to get married). When he confronted me after a frenemy of mine told him of my disloyalty, i lied straight through my teeth, and had to continue doing so with varying degrees of frequency ever since. I still wonder if one day, ten years from now, or more, when we have kids and a mortgage if it will come back to bite me in the ass somehow.

Due to your bravery and honesty in handling it, I'm pretty confident that you will be able to get past it, and be better off for it (in terms of establishing boundaries and general relationship ground rules, not only regarding the jealousy and the snooping but for how you will handle conflicts in the future).
((((DJ)))) I, too, have screwed myself over with my bust posts... back when an ex and I were on the verge of our really tough break-up (still trying to make it work, still failing pretty miserably), i busted about a crush I had, on one of my teachers. Nothing ever happened with the crush, but my then-boyfriend read about it and it definitely didn't help us smooth our relationship problems over. I also posted around that time about some things I thought my then-boyfriend was being a real jerk about-- and actually, I think that DID help us, for him to read that. He was able to see what page I was on, and it helped him to communicate better with me about those problems.


THAT SAID- I really do think that a significant other who reads their partner's posts is *seriously* invading their privacy. as fas as i'm concerned, it's equivalent to listening in on a phone conversation or reading a diary. yeah yeah, it's a public forum, but it's one that you expect to be a part of with women like yourself, with friends-- NOT with your boyfriend. so honestly, i think that HIS breach of trust (reading your posts) is nearly on the level of YOUR breach of trust (lying about having a partner since him). and that being the case, i think it's totally out of line for him to be taking some supposed moral high ground.

STILL- i think that this could possibly turn into a good opportunity for both of you to do some soul-searching about what sexual histories, trust, etc. mean to you, both collectively and individually. it might turn out that it makes you stronger, as a couple and as people. good luck, dear!
brookelynne, i have a friend that is in a similar situation, so i know that must be so awful for you! i hate to say it, but i told the truth because i knew i was caught. i never would have lied in the first place if i thought that would ever be a possibility. also, i wanted him to see me in a certain light, which was manipulative and selfish.

octinoxate, once again, i have to agree with you, the fact that he semi-stalked me still gnaws at me from time to time. i didn't call him out on it much at first because i felt it would appear that i was deflecting and trying to avoid the issue. but it don't think this a make or break kind of problem. there is way more good than bad in this relationship.

phobia, he's never brought it up during fights, it's just in the back of our minds during conversations about a variety of different things. seeing him this past weekend made things so much better. we were able to reconnect and it seemed like we were going to move on. but........

when i got back i noticed something that seemed strange to me on my vagina. it looked like a polyp or a herpetic sore, so i started FREAKING out. not only because i was terrified of having an STD, but also because i was terrified of having to tell him about it. he would then, automatically assume that i had gotten it from random-bad-fuck and then probably passed it on to him, at least that's the way it played out in my mind. turns out i had an inclusion cyst, basically a white-head and i was all worked up for nothing. i thought it was a funny story, so i told him about it and we somehow fell back into the whole rigamarole again. honestly, even though it bothers him and he's forgiven me and said he's moved on, i think i might be the one causing the drama here. i think i have some deeply rooted issues with my own sexual past, a kind of self-loathing that manifests in this way: i'm a dirty whore and no decent man would want me because of where i've been. now, intuitively and logically, i KNOW that is not true. but even just saying those words (or typing them) allows them to take root in my subconscious, and there they stay. i do believe he's forgiven me, that he loves me, that he wants to be with me. i need to reconcile that with my own self-deprecation issues. it's a battle between what i know and what i have been conditioned (by society, my peers, my family, whatever) to feel.

in the end, i think he and i will be ok and i need to stop obsessing over this imperfection. i need to concentrate on what's good about myself and learn on all levels of my thinking, that i deserve to be with a good man, no matter what my sexual history has been.

thanks so much for all the words of wisdom.
QUOTE(dj-bizmonkey @ Oct 18 2007, 07:52 PM) *
in the end, i think he and i will be ok and i need to stop obsessing over this imperfection. i need to concentrate on what's good about myself and learn on all levels of my thinking, that i deserve to be with a good man, no matter what my sexual history has been.

hells yeah, DJ. if he's a good guy, which he must be if you're with him, then he's staying with you because none of that past stuff matters. maybe it's true that it's in the back of your mind but not so much his anymore. if you drop it and he still brings it up a lot, then yes, that's a red flag.
Agreed, DJ -- you need to let go of this shame of your past. If you really feel like you're a terrible person nobody would want, maybe there's some additional issues that need worked out -- the "problem" is not that you've been around the block, nor even that other people might think you're a slut, but rather how YOU'RE feeling about it. I just think if this immense guilt and shame over your past is starting to impact your ability to have a relationship with a guy you really like, it might be time to get to the bottom of it. Good luck!!!
Hey everybody! So, I'm finally getting Mcgeek to sort of purge (or rather give up the ghost) of his ex wife. He's put pictures of me around in his house, and is getting rid of the majority of her stuff. I basically told him that I wasn't moving in with him (and I don't plan to fully until my lease is up) until all this crap is resolved.

It was just getting painful to walk into a room, and realize that part of her was still there. I don't think he even realized it.

I'm just dealing with the new stress of living with someone part time. That's been harder than I thought. dry.gif

forgive me for being blunt but your man is totally manipulating you. it's a trap. it really irks me to read your story i suppose because i have been involved with some manipulative boyfriends. i won't bore you with the details but suffice to say in my experience a guy like that is never going to be happy. it's always going to be something else he's holding over your head. he sounds immature. i'm really sorry if that's blunt. i don't mean to be rude however he is totally playing on your insecurities. he knows you feel badly about this one night stand and he is just playing it up to have control over you. that's all it comes down to. i hope i'm wrong but it sounds like he is totally playing with your mind.

okay you guys weren't even together when you slept with this other guy. why is he making such a big deal about it? because you lied about it? so what. why did he even want to know if you'd been with other guys in the first place (during your time apart)?? that's what i want to know. who cares who you slept with before him. doesn't he understand that you're with him now and that's what counts?

you sound like a smart lady and i'm sure you already know all this stuff it just bugs me to hear you say that you feel ashamed about your sexual past. i struggle with pretty strong feelings of shame too. i don't even totally understand why i do have feelings of shame but it's an awful feeling. i'm sorry you struggle with it too but your guy is manipulating you. gah!
Okay, so I need to know. Am I wrong for thinking it is incredibly inappropriate for Mr GGG's ex (baby mama) to call him when she is having man trouble, and for him to spend an hour on the phone with her giving her a "pep talk" about how wonderful she is? Not that she isn't or that I want them to not be friends, I just think it is really inappropriate. He is MY cheerleader now, not hers.
ggg, i dunno, because i've felt similarly about mr.nick's conversations with his ex. i am also cool with them talking. i'd hope if we broke up we'd still be in touch. i'm still in touch with my ex. but he's told me she's often depressed and insecure, so when he's on the phone with her, it sounds like he's talking to a 10-year old. i don't want to be treated like a 10-year old, but yeah, i want him worrying about me, not her!

i guess the rational answer is that he is still your cheerleader first, he's your man, and she's his EX for a reason. but it's worth talking to him about how it makes you feel. i should do the same i suppose.
oh, shit, ggg. this would piss me off! but my tendency is to over react about stuff like this. i am not of the opinion that there should only be discussion about the child. however there are some things that would not seem appropriate. this is totally one of them. relationship/ sex life type stuff is no longer anything they have in common. thee is no reason to talk about it with her.
I'm not pissed, just a little, miffed. The thing is this, if the shoe were on the other foot and her boyfriend was doing this, she would shit a brick.

I understand that they are always going to be connected via the kids, but I feel like she is disrepsecting our relationship by doing this, in as far as, she would not tolerate this in her own relationship. I don't want to resent her, but I feel like the two of them are disrespecting me and my position in Mr's life when this happens.
Okay, this might sound like a strange question. I find that most of the decisions I make in life I make in regards to my relationship. Meaning, when I decide how many classes I’m going to take, I think about how far is that going to push back graduation, how much longer will Mr. Pug have to continue to be the only income in the home.

When I think about what we are having for dinner I think about what Mr. Pug would like to have. I mean I won’t make something I don’t like but I will make something that he likes a little more then myself because when he eats his favorite meal it makes him happy which in turn makes me happy.

I mean when I bought my lunapads I didn’t think about would this make things easier on us. I thought it would make things easier on me.

But, I find that a lot of the decisions I make I really do think about us more then just myself. IMO, this is a good thing because it strengthens our relationship. I really think Mr. Pug does the same thing.

For example, we just bought a brand new 60 inch plasma tv. Now technically, it’s Mr. Pug’s money but untechnically (yes I’m making up words) it’s our money. We talked about it and settled on a price. When he went shopping for the new tv (I was home studying) the one he wanted ended up being $500 more then we agreed to spend. Now he could have just bought it, seeing that it’s the money he has earned, but he called to tell me that there was a price difference. We talked about it over the phone and we ended up spending the extra money to get what we (he) really wanted. He works so hard and deserves it and to be honest I wanted the nicer one too. When he got home I asked him, “If I was really against spending the extra money would you have downgraded?” He said absolutely. That we are a couple and it’s “our” money. I believe him to my core.

I guess what I’m saying is that I have this one friend who acts like this when he is in a relationship. We’ll call him F. He jumps from relationship to relationship and he is a prime example of this selfish attitude I’m talking about. He seems to just care about himself and not the relationship. Maybe this is why he is always in and out of relationships. Does anyone else see this? He is so immature. In all honesty, he’s 28 years old and still only works part time at a supermarket and sits on his ass all day playing PlayStation while he lives off his parents. He never pays his rent on time and gets his parents to pay for repairs to his car and then never pays them back. He needs to grow up. This has been going on for 11+ years now. He’s never going to change. Guess this post is just to vent about what a lazy ass he is. So glad that he didn’t rub off on Mr. Pug when they were growing up together. I’m lucky.
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