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sorry to barge in here but I have a mother problem too. Since my Dad died (which was super difficult for me) we have been completely unable to communicate. My sister suggested us going to councelling together so I think I'm going to try it.

Sometimes I completely want to not have her around but the idea of losing both parents is devastating. I'm just trying to make positive changes for myself and she is nothing but critical. Then I get defensive and it just spirals. I'm tired of it all.

((everyone)) I don't feel qualified to give advice, only understanding of the frustration.
most states but california and new york, freespirit...unless u are in 29 palms...
ap, u rock in my opinion for having your crap together despite your mothers undoings. kudos to u.

mornington--who likes being treated like a child? no one. good for you for standing up for yourself.



Is everyone's families all picture perfect bundles of functioning togetherness yet?

Yeah. My dad is a mentally ill abuser whom I was never close to growing up. He left my mom four years ago, when I was 22. My younger brothers and I hardly have a relationship with him anymore. We are all socially inept in our own way, and my mom hardly has any emotional support at all from outside the family because she really doesn't have any friends. Being the oldest (and a girl), I was always her confidante....she never really thought about how inappropriate the things she was telling me really were. And we still have these messed up today I somehow got involved (and really worked up over) an argument my parents had over what price my childhood home should go on the market for. I just started thinking only about 6 months ago about how inappropriate it is that she tells me all these things I never should be involved in. I have finally have started telling her I don't want to hear it, but then secretly feel guilty because she has no other outlet to express her frustration. At the same time, she lets people walk all over her and I hate seeing it all the time.
Sorry to rant, I just don't know how to deal with this shit.
*rant incoming*
My father. Amusingly enough, vs My Brother The Boy Wonder, round one, *ding*.

My father is remarried to a silly bitch of a woman who clearly resents both his offspring. I'm banned from the house - whole 'nother saga, therapy etc etc - and now it seems she's about to start work on my little brother (The Boy Wonder is seventeen). They - she and my father - have a two-bed house, of which they've converted the attic room into a third bedroom. Her daughter (my step-sister, yes, my father adopted her) has that room, The BW has the second bedroom.

Or at least that's the theory. But they (read: she) has decided they want to keep thier bedroom "clear" and so the wardobe etc holding my dad's clothes is in the second bedroom. Along with all the boxes of things they have.

There is no room for the BW to have a bed. He sleeps on the couch. He's living with them for nearly a month - until my mum moves to her new posting (she moves around the world a lot, he's based in the uk). BW feels - quite understandibly - rather unloved, not to say a wee bit pissed off. I'm thinking of finding a three-bed house next year so I can have BW to stay as much as he wants when he's not in school.

I'm pissed off for him, and I feel helpless because, right now, there's nothing I can do.

(((gumby))) & (((dysfunctional busties)))
My parents actually moved when I first went away to uni (and didn't at first give me the address), and during breaks when the dorms were closed my mom made it very clear that I would occasionally be allowed to stay in the "guest" room. I too have a BW younger brother who encountered much hostility after I was no longer around to be target. 'Course, these were our bio parents, such as they were. I found the thing that helped the most was just being there to listen when he needed to vent, and to let him know that this is not normal behavior for parents. Not that we didn't know they were f*cked, it was just good to be reminded.
Sorry to barge in here... ((mornington))) ((all busties))

So, I go on this trip for my father's birthday this past weekend. I thought that we had two rooms. No. So, I'm stuck in a mountain town with my bitchy parents (who were in shitty moods when they picked me up from work that day) for three days straight bitching at everything from my new job, my new boyfriend (who I'm not even really sure if he is or not b/c everything is so new) to my weight (Right now I'm on two meds, and slowly decreasing one for my seizures. Anyways, that's what is causing the weight gain). I tried to tell them all this, but it didn't help. I even said: "Mom, it's these drugs. Once I get off Drug B it will be better..." "Well, you're probably just tired from having a boyfriend!" Hello? She was already implying that I'm fucking him, and she hasn't even met him!!

And, my mother was criticizing everything I ate, both of them knowing full well I was bloated and pmsing...."J, that's bread! It's full of carbs!!" Please stick your carbs up your arse Mom!

I've never been so happy to get back to work on Monday in my life.

And they wonder why my sister does not talk to them, or why I'm still in therapy. Yet another reason to not go on vacation with them unless we have separate spaces. The reason the trip to Portland worked out, is b/c we weren't all cramped in one room together... So hoping that we won't have to go on a vacation in a long time. Also, so glad that they leave a few states away.
Sassygirl, I insist on separate spaces when on vacay with family. Not least because I'm cranky first thing in the morning and don't like to inflict myself on people. I feel my family and I get the best from each other if we're not arguing over who gets the first shower or about having the TV on at 8am. As soon as a trip is in planning stages I just quietly book a room for myself. Otherwise I find we all exhaust our goodwill to each other fairly quickly.

It is also perfectly possible that I'm just a control freak.

Mornington, your poor brother! Any chance at all your dad will convince 2nd wife to let him have the room and a bed to himself for the month? If not, your plan to make space for him in your own place is a good one (although it shouldn't be necessary IMO). Everyone should have a room they can call their own.

i have decided to just stop talking to my sister . She sent me an email trying to guilt me into speaking with her and I deleted it. She is a miserable bitch.

The problem now is that my father wants to leave everything to me because she and her husband have pissed him off too.

It's weird I was always the black sheep of the family and now I am the greatest daughter ever. At least we can all agree that we don't want to deal with my sister.

Just cuz we are related doesnt mean I have to put up with her obnoxious rude bitchiness.
My sister and I were finally being really cool to each other this year, but sadly, that ended this weekend. It was my birthday, we were drunk and at a casino. She lost a lot of money and got cranky and snapped at me for no reason. Somehow this turned into mutual character assasination and eventually she slapped me acoss the face. Slapped on my birthday. awesome.
(((Greenbean)))(((Misslady)))(((all the busties)))
My sister and I are attempting to have a relationship. But there is a 10 year age differnce and about a 100 other differnces between us, so it's difficult. All of our lives our mother pitted us against each other. So we are weeding through all the things she has sad over the years sorting fact from fiction. Trying to forgive, and trying to trust. But this is really our last chance. If things don't work out now I don't know how we'll ever fix things.
(((ginger_kitty))) (((greenbean))) (((misslady))) (((sixe))) (((busties)))

Saw Boy Wonder today. We have a plan for him to live with me next year - he's at boarding school, so it won't be all the time. It involves futons and the lounge, but at least he will have a chest of drawers or something. It will be his space when he wants it.

It also appears my father is having problems understanding the concept of "food"... BW has no food in the fridge! And (being seventeen) no money. I feel sorry for him; while I still resent being effectively frozen out of my father's life, I saw him much less, and we weren't close. BW sees him regularly, and it seems now my stepmother has got rid of me, she's getting rid of him. She won't even speak to him.

The worst bit was that I was starting to work towards a better relationship with my father - as much to maintain BW's relationship with him as for me - and I'm starting to realise that it's going to be impossible as he isn't strong enough to stand up to the woman he married. It scares me that he will lose both his children, because he doesn't have any other close family - he doesn't really speak to his brother as there's such an age gap between them. We are his family, and much as I would hope he and the stepmother will grow old together happily, I can't see it.

Oh, and apparently, he's changing job. He neglected to tell us, and my mother found out through a colleague of his (they both work for the same organisation). He's a knob. *sigh*
your brother is lucky to have you

thanks ladies,
It is nice to know that I am not the only one with sister issues. I just think it is best if I don't have a relationship with her.

but man if she slapped me, damm thats cold.
Yeah, I think its sooo weird that my sister got physical because our parents NEVER laid a hand on us so I dont know were she learned that behavior. I know I was being a smart ass and I think I called her a 'princess' or something, but still, she could of kept it verbal. We still havent talked since and I'm really sad because we were doing so well for the last 3 years.

missladyj--I hope it works out for you, either way. Personally I couldn't cut out my sister permanently, but if thats what your situation calls for then I support it.

mornington--my ex-bf had stepmother issues very similiar to yours. I just cant believe how childish grown-ups can be. Its effin ridiculous.
OK bitchy sister rant!

My sister whom ONLY calls me when she A. Wants something, B. Is bored or C. My neice asks about me is coming to visit me for her honeymoon.

She wanted to stay with us (in a one bedroom and she is pregnant?!) so we got her a hotel room (Happy Late Wedding/early baby shower prezzie)

And she is coming to visit the EXACT TIMES when we were going to see our absolute FAVORITE band MUSE.

I am beyond pissed off.

Not only am I probably never going to get to see them live again in the US but I have to cancel our tickets and spend the evening with my sister listening to her bitch about being diabetic while pregnant and poor (yet they CHOOSE to have another kid?!)

Oh cruel world.

*knocking head against desk*
keenkitty, is she just visiting the one night? If not, I'd go to the concert. She sounds a little selfish to me.

(((keenkitty, greenbean, misslady, gingerkitty, sassy, sixe, and all the dysfuctional bustie)))

The usual blah. Stepmother not speaking to brother. Funny moment though - mum went round to thier house to pick up some of my brother's stuff, and wanted to arrange a good time. My dad told her to "come round during the day, as what [my stepmother] doesn't know won't bother her". It seems he finds her a little difficult too. I almost feel sorry for him at times like this, but I do hope he's happy. *sigh*
(((keenkitty))) I'd go to the concert and skip the sister hell!!! But I tend to be put myself over my family since they tend to be nightmarish.

(((mornington, greenbean, all the other busties)))

This weekend I have to a big welcome home party for my older sis. She has been away in the army for 2 yrs so tons of family members will be there. My family just makes me so tense, b/c they make the tinyist things incredibly complicated.

For instance, my mother has disowned my sister. But my sister wanted to invite her to the party, but she didn't want to speak to her so she made me invite my parents. And we had to make up an excuse that I was inviting half the people for her so my mom wouldn't freak out about my sis not asking her. Which somehow lead to me actually having to invite half the guest list....most of whom I haven't spoken to in years. Then my mother was all aloof on the phone like she is unsure if she be able to attend. The woman does literally nothing! Okay, done ranting until after the party, Saturday.....
(((Gingerkitty, mornington, greenbean, everyone)))

keenkitty, I would totally go to that concert, too. Did she even call to ask if you already had plans at that time? I'm betting no, so, I'd totally see her during the day and see the concert at night...

gingerkitty, my family does that too. I finally had to say "um, no. I don't do that." Which is also why I don't know what's going on with my family most of the time, because they are like if you don't wanna play our weird little games then obviously you just don't care...*sigh*. whatever.

So, for some reason I told my dad I would go play poker with him at one of his tourneys. He plays 5/6 nights a week at various pubs. I'm such a crap player, I think I just got caught up in being happy for him to finally be getting out of the house and having a hobby. Damn. At least there'll be beer....

And this was kind of funny: I bought a PDA, but ended up selling it to a co-worker b/c it didn't do everything I needed it to. Before I sold it I had showed it to my mom as she does IT stuff and owns 2 herself. The co-worker just told me that she had programmed "call your mother" like a hundred times into the calendar, so it pops up at random times (which kind of freaked him out, 'cause his mom's dead).....
I haven't seen my father since last November. He wanted to see my for my birthday (at the end of June), but never called to make plans with me. He finally sent me an email last week asking me to email dates in August I was available to see him. I only gave him two weekends because I was going away with my boyfriend on a two week trip. I wrote it very nicely and added that if those two dates I had listed didn't work, then perhaps when I get back, in the beginning of September would be better for him. He just sent me an email back that said, "Then why don't we just wait for Christmas"...doesn't even fucking mention if the dates even work for him or not. He just has to be the fucking whiny crybaby and I have to be the adult...every single time. I even did what he asked me to. God.
Sorry. End rant.

Gingerkitty, how was the party? At least it's over....

Keenkitty, I'd probably go to the concert, too.


I completely unerstand. In my personal experience I've always been the parent....with both of them. It completely sucks. I mean I am only 18, on my way to finishing high school, but I still live with mom. She has indirectly forced me to take care of myself most of my life...and then take care of my sibbling because her then husband was too fucking lazy and she worked. Since then (they split about 4 years ago) things have only gotten worse. It has always been about her...her feelings come first, her needs, I mean don't get me wrong she has always provided financially, just never emotionally...lately my mother has just been plain nasty and well controlling trying to keep me from independence just so she can have a little extra cash. AAHHHHHHHHH! Why should it be about money, why is it always? The latest episode was last night when I came home, and she picked a fight with me about how I didn't help her wash the took all day. Who the fuck takes a whole day to clean the car and well when I awoke yesterday I got bitched at because she couldn't find the measuring cups...I just didn't respond because I knew I'd explode...when she finally calmed down I simply told her they were in the strainer from when I did the dishes(SUNDAY). Ok enough ranting and back to my origional thoughts. My father has never been a part of my life unless it was convenient for him...I just finally stopped waiting for him to make plans with it's if I can see him around my busy schedule not his. Your story reminded me of somthing I would call a sperm doner classic....Something my sperm doner has done many, many times. He's the sperm doner because basiclly it's the only real thing that he's done. Dad is a word I would use to describe the person who took care of me and I and have some communication with; and father is a loving word I would use to describe the person who raised me. I've never had a father, I did, however, have a dad who coincidently was my sterp-father. He raised me but there was never a loving feeling between us. Good luck with all.

keenkitty, what did you decide?

Some classic quotes from our latest "family conversation"... oh it's all such fun.

me: yes dad, but when I have more contact with my ex-boyfriend that with you, why do you think I'm a little tetchy?

and from my mother: it's like announcing that we're all going to play strip poker, but then she decides to stand on the sidelines and watch. She's not actually interacting.

We appear to have come to the root of the problem - my stepmother refuses to acknowledge that my father wishes to have his children in his life. Thier marriage is being put under strain due to her idiocy. That was two weeks ago and we have progressed... no further. there is not even a whisper of progression. *head/desk*


I haven't checked back here to report how the family party went. Actually, it went really well, I hadn't seen my nephews or niece for years, so I was psyched. They are growing up way to fast! And my BIL's daugher from a previous marriage is really grown up too! She was telling me about a school trip to Europe and stuff. It was awesome to catch up w/ everyone,

My parents came and made nice with my sister. But they told her husband he was fat. (They have a knack for being rudely blunt.) After the party they all promptly decided to go back to not talking. Leaving me in the middle....first, my mom called like 2 hrs after I left to complain that I didn't talk to her enough and see if my sister or anyone else talked about her. Then my sis calls me the next day to get the scoop on what my parents said about her....I am staying out of it and not relaying messages or gossip to either one of them.
QUOTE(mornington @ Aug 9 2006, 06:45 PM) *


keenkitty, what did you decide?

Some classic quotes from our latest "family conversation"... oh it's all such fun.

me: yes dad, but when I have more contact with my ex-boyfriend that with you, why do you think I'm a little tetchy?

and from my mother: it's like announcing that we're all going to play strip poker, but then she decides to stand on the sidelines and watch. She's not actually interacting.

We appear to have come to the root of the problem - my stepmother refuses to acknowledge that my father wishes to have his children in his life. Thier marriage is being put under strain due to her idiocy. That was two weeks ago and we have progressed... no further. there is not even a whisper of progression. *head/desk*


Again I feel dumb, but which part of your post was directed to me? Still kind of new to the whole posting bit and I'm not to sure what the name in parenthesees means?
dynamite - the parenthesis around your name basically mean that although I've got nothing constructive to say, I'm giving internet hugs and support to you.

(((gkitty))), gah on being stuck in the middle, although I'm glad the party went well.
QUOTE(mornington @ Aug 10 2006, 07:46 AM) *

dynamite - the parenthesis around your name basically mean that although I've got nothing constructive to say, I'm giving internet hugs and support to you.

(((gkitty))), gah on being stuck in the middle, although I'm glad the party went well.

Well, now that I understand, thank so much.
Well, I am moving from my Mom's on the 27th....not getting a place of my own though, just going to live with my Nanna...Hope this works out better in the long run.
hope all of you are doing well... i don't mean to hijack the thread and what you've already got in progress, but i'm having some issues with my mom.

first some background: mom has always been a drinker. she starts drinking every day around 5, but sometimes its as early as 2pm. she drinks all evening, and only eats one or two meals a day. she has been drinking this way ever since i was a teenager. when she gets drunk, she yells and screams and degrades whomever her target happens to be. frequently, its her current husband or my grandma (her mom) who lives with her. usually its about how they just need to do things her way, or how they're too old, stupid. lazy, fat (insert adjective) to do anything at all. she is very controlling- for example, none of my stepdad's family is allowed at her house, and she refuses to visit them.
then there is her other side: she is giving (like in a charitable way) and willing to help others, for example, she paid for a poor family to have central heat and air installed in their home as a christmas gift. when my brother and i need something, she is the first one to offer assistance, whether it is money or doing something for/with us to help.

my boyfriend and i are planning our wedding. we just moved to a bigger apartment, we both just got raises at work, we are happy and doing great. in about a month, we are going on a cruise with my mom and stepdad (they said it was only fair since they took my brother and sister in law on one a few years ago). my mom also came over and helped on our recent moving day. we weren't going to take this apartment b/c it did not come with appliances, but my mom insisted on getting them for us b/c she wanted us to live in this particular place- they are business-friends with the landlord.

the current problem is that yesterday everything blew apart. my mom called at 3pm, already drunk, and rambling some nonsense about how she knew that matt and i had secretly changed all the wedding food with the caterer. (not true and completely weird of her to mention) she said that matt should have nothing to do with the wedding until his mom starts paying for something besides the rehearsal dinner. then she said that i need to start telling him what to do, and i need to "get control," because we shouldn't make decisions together, that i should make them all and he should do what i say. (that is what happens in her marriage). then she said that all he wanted was a "free ride" from me (in actuality, we both work and contribute equally). i explained to her that she and i were different, that i appreciated her opinion, but i felt things were going quite well. as many of you know, there is no reasoning with a drunk person. i tried to be polite to her, but ended up crying and had to hang up on her. she said that the only reason i was talking to her that way (disagreeing) was because i didn't currently "need" anything from her at the moment. we never asked for anything- she offered those things, and i've told her no many times about other stuff.

matt and i agree that we are not going to take any more money/help from them, since it is becoming an issue. but we can't undo what is done- we are supposed to be going to europe with them in a little over a month. she also intends to pay for half of our reception, but she is getting really demanding about it (she hates my dress, argued with me over flowers, doesn't even want the groom's mom involved whatsoever). my mom only does this to me when i am happy.

i haven't talked to her for a day or so, and although she has done a lot when she was drunk before and i could tell some bad stories about that, this is the worst. sometimes i feel like i just don't want her in my life because she causes so much hurt, and i know she'll never quit drinking or needing control of all of us. she won't change at all- but how can i deal with it?

I too have to deal with a drunk mother. She was like this all weekend. I only see her and my father (they both drink) about once every six months. This weekend was the worst! I live a state away (in GA and not in SC) due to this fact.

It was all about the fact that I have gained some weight, and that I had no energy. I basically wanted to sleep all weekend, but I thought I had a right too being it was my vacation. Hell, I had had two seizures this past week, and they knew about this! She got all angry at me for sleeping b/c I was a "guest at their house..." and the fact that she wanted to show me off. What the fuck am I? Their daughter or their show trophy? I'm sure some of this stems from the fact that my sister does not talk to them, for this main reason.

I've never been so happy to get home to my shitty apartment, my bad flatemates, and my crap job.

All good busty vibes.

I had to go to my grandmother's 80th birthday party today. It was pretty crappy. Some of my aunts and uncles didn't even bother to say hello to me or anyone in my immediate family. One of my aunts came up to say hi and when I started to talk to her I quickly discovered she was only chatting with me to try to pawn my mentally handicapped aunt off on me because she didn't want to give her a ride home. Even though that aunt lives like an hour and half out of my way. So as soon as I told her I couldn't she walked away and didn't talk to me again.

My one brother kept getting called my other brothers name, by everyone even though they don't even look alike. My nephews were miserable, b/c one had poison ivy and the other had a broken ankle. My mother was wondering around juct generally acting insane. My unlce's wife made us pose for a ton of photos.

They only brought one cake for like 50 people, b/c they are cheap! There were no snacks our anything. It was really lame. Then they only rented the place for like 3 hrs, so my aunt and uncle that paid for the place just started packing away chairs and vacuuming the floor b/c people were hanging out and not leaving.

I hate my family!
my mom is at it again.
we are on a cruise- i am posting from the "internet cafe." i'm not really a cruise person, but i had the chance for three days in barcelona so i jumped on it, of course. i have had a wonderful time so far, but with mom it has been bitchfest 2006, vacation edition.
she doesn't like european anything- food, customs, etc. in barcelona, all she did was stay at the hotel mostly. complained the whole time that she couldn't wait to get on the ship. now we are on the ship, which is nice enough, but after wonderful barcelona, it looks like wal-mart of the seas to me. still, i am happy and excited about the ports we're visiting and its all good.
she didn't come out of her room all afternoon because she was drinking and mad b/c she couldn't find anything she wanted to purchase today in marseilles. then, we had a private party on board for the group we are with, at which she drank at least 4 drinks within an hour. tonight was formal night in the dining room, where you dress up and they give you extra good food. she yelled about how i didn't love her, and how my brother and SIL doesn't approve of the place where matt and i are getting married. said she was still in love with my dad and told my step-dad it was over. when i tried to say something, she told me to shut the f up. later, she started crying about how she misses her dog at home. this was all during the formal dinner, where we were seated with people we don't know, and the waitstaff is trying to serve dinner quickly so that the second seating can come in. i was extremely upset but trying not to act like it, and the nice couple we sit with asked if i was ok, and told me to do my wedding however i want. it was just awful and embarrassing...
we are on a european cruise. we have good food, drinks, fun excursions, and we are in freaking europe. i don't understand what the problem is. the last thing i heard was that she was going to try to go home early at the next port. i doubt she will, though.
i asked matt tonight if he wanted to elope, and he said no, which is what he said the last time i asked, about a month and a half ago when she got like this last. a lot of her angst is about my wedding. it sucks all the fun out.
i am going to go have a beer and get my stuff ready for exploring Nice and Cannes tommorrow, because she's not ruining my vacation. or my wedding. so there.
(((pinkmartyr))) You CAN have your wedding the way you want.

I'm dealing with stupid family stress too. I posted it in Kvetch and dont feel like doing it again.
Ugh. Can I just come in here and join all of you? My family is driving me batty (yet again) as well. From the primadonna younger sister who think she's the eldest sister (no, honey, that would be me; too bad you've had a problem with me all of your 30something years) to the immature mother who never grew up, I can't take it anymore.

Wal-Mart of the seas! hahaha... PM, I hear Barcelona is really beautiful.
i'm sure this thread will be getting lots of hits with the upcoming holiday season.

yesterday my mom agreed with me when i said i'm not going to even bother coming home for thanksgiving. it is just too depressing. they have dinner at my grandma's house. she used to live in this creepy apartment in jersey city which i loved when i was a kid. then she had a stroke and now she lives in a big house near my folks house with a lady who takes care of her. she is really disabled now, and no one wants to take care of her since the house is out in the middle of nowhere and none of these ladies have cars. the new lady is from georgia (the country) and her husband lives there too. my mom says they are very nice. my dad has been super depressed over the whole thing. he retired after my grandma got sick and is just miserable. he tries to keep it together, but he should really get some help. my mom is really resentful because she gets stuck taking care of my grandma a lot and has given up on trying to make the holidays traditional or fun. and my brother will be there just moping around like angsty young men do.

so i think i'm going to go to my boyfriend's parent's house for thanksgiving. they are crazy in their own way, but at least they'll take out the nice table settings and pretend to be happy.
Yes, the holiday season is bringing up all the family crap. My dad called me on Friday. He calls me usually once a year on my birthday. Whenever he calls he asks the same two questions: How's your love life, how's school? He's always been able to ask that second question because I'm a teacher and I never really left school. However, this call was different. My stepmother, who has battled cancer for years, has about two weeks to live. The cancer is in her brain. Egad. Here's the problem: I don't like her. She's a mean, spiteful woman. She's done more to damage my relationship with my father than any other human I can think of, my dad and myself included. I don't think because of these things she deserves cancer or a tragic death, but I'm having a hard time mustering up real emotion about this. I feel the same as if a coworker told me a relative of theirs I never met is dying. "Oh, that's awful. I'm sorry." I feel bad for my dad, but I also feel that he's chosen to do whatever she's said for 22 years. Including ignoring his own children for her and her children. I feel very selfish in my feelings, but I really can't bring myself to feel anything real about this. Does anyone out there have a similar situation?
((((persimmon)))) I honestly don't have any advice.
(((kelkello))) I have a similar relationship with my stepmother - whenever I'm given any news of her, my response is always forced and non-commital.

My brother is coming to live with me for two weeks straight while he's on half-term from school - he can't go to our mum overseas as he has hockey matches to play in and uni open days to go to - because my stepmother doesn't want him in the house. Apparently she can't fuction properly when he's around. My brother's response was "this all seems terribly familiar" because she did this to me two years ago. It just pisses me off - while I'm more than glad to have him, we get on etc etc, I won't get any help with the bills or food from our father, I'll have to pay for his travel card and give up my space to him - and have to deal with my hound freaking out because he's not good with men. I'm trying not to be pissed at my brother - it's not his faulty and we will be fine in all probability - but the only reason I'm aware of this (and half term is, uh, a week on friday) is because our mum warned me. She also had to tell my brother that he wouldn't be allowed to stay with his father and had to live with his loony sister instead. My father is a coward.

(((dysfuctional busties)))
I harbour a massive amount of anger at my sister who is eight years older than me.This year she told me that she was molestered and then inturn molestered my brother (this happened when she was about 12-13) then my brother molestered me.She has always harboured a dislike for me and has put me down at every oportunity. She has done the therapy.I've done a bit,but can't seem to forgive her for fucking up my self worth and self esteme.Yes I do hate her and whadya know,it's her engagement party this Saturday.I absolutely obhor her fiance and hope that they have nothing but a miserable marriage.I told her how I felt about him and that I thought she was making a big mistake but my sister has never taken my opinions seriously.I know that I wasted my time in telling her how I felt and that I was just probably projecting my hatred towards her and using him as an excuse.I still think she is making a huge mistake and we will probably never have any sort of relationship again.It was never equal anyway so I'm probably better off without her.
Thanks for letting me vent.
anna k
((((datagirl))) That is so horrible and sick. Good riddance to the two of them.

I hate being around my dad. For as long as I can remember, he has been bitter and harsh and aggressive and loud and obnoxious. My head hurts with remembering all the nasty, ignorant things he has said and how I brace myself around him, feeling stiff and uncomfortable. I can't love him the way I love my mom. I know he has dissapointmentss in his life work-wise, but I had plenty of shit in my childhood and dealt with it. I like peace and understanding, and can't stand him being bitter or harsh. I hate it when he makes fun of my mom's siblings but he barely talks to his blind sister who has seperated herself from the family, it's as if she doesn't exist. He wouldn't care if one of my mom's siblings died, but when his dad died it was a huge event for our family, and his dad's name is brought up at every major family event.

Once he snapped his fingers harshly at me while we were at an Olive Garden on vacation. I was miserable and kept quiet, and he snapped his fingers in front of my face. It may have been two years ago, but since his attitude hasn't changed, I find it hard to forgive him.

During the weekend, when we were going to go somewhere, a woman next door said hi to us, and she had two big dogs. The dogs came over, and my dad immediately tells my brother not to touch them (my brother is 19 years old, not 5). The woman and the dogs are friendly, but my dad keeps saying, "We have to go," and when she's out of earshot, he calls the woman a wacko. Twice. That shit sticks in my head, and it's hypocritical because he said he moved to the South because people are more friendly than New Yorkers, but he still acts like a bitter jerky New Yorker who hates "faw-reigners," poor black people, poor Latinos, Asians, and Muslims.

I want to scream at him and tell him that I never loved him, that his bullshit attitude throughout my life has made me not love him and that it's all his fault that I had to tolerate his assy behavior. He would say something like, "I'm your father, I've been there all your life." And he'd expect a fucking medal. He may have been there, but he felt more like a burden to endure than someone who I would love and trust. I always felt in fear and bracing myself for whatever he'd do next. My mom understands, but she loves him and knows him differently than I do. I still can't make myself love him, no matter what.

pinkmartyr, my dad was like that in Montreal. We went there, and he didn't know any French and refused to understand any of it. He wouldn't respond to a waiter if the waiter spoke French, looking at him until he switched to English. He drove the way he does in New York, honking and cursing at people, and said nasty shit about French people, Arabs being greedy, and pointed out "two chinks crossing the street." He didn't want to go to a French resturant, didn't want to visit Quebec City when my mom suggested it, and acted like a xenophobic asshole, which was a huge downer. I loved Montreal, but hated him being there with me and acting like a jerkoff.
(((anna k))) Thank you.

Families can really fuck us up.The other night I layed in bed crying because I felt that I couldn't do anything else.I felt so powerless and I hate feeling that way.If I write my sister a letter (I can't talk to her),she would say that I shouldn't blame anyone for what happened as I 'own' my reactions and feelings to things.A fucking cop out of thing to say and really quite regressive.I'm still angry and I have no idea where to direct that anger.I know that there will be no Christmas this year so I'm going to get very drunk at the beach.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I don't want to be negative anymore but I just can't seem to let this go. My siblings are sick fucks and I can't deal with it.
I think one of the hardest things is really and truly realizing that you aren't going to change people like that. You somehow, subconsciously most likely, feel as if you just are persuasive enough, explain enough, persistant enough, or whatever, they will start behaving better, understand what you are saying/feeling, respect it, etc, etc etc.

It's ok to stay away from your family or anyone who is unhealthy for you. It's ok to cut off/distance yourself in all kinds of ways. It's actually a very good idea sometimes.

The details of exactly when/how/how much, etc, are of course much more complicated. But I just wanted to say that.
Thanks Anoushh,
My brother and sister were/are toxic.My sister had her engagement party on Saturday night.Mt sister's fiance's father just refused to acknowledge my parents as my mother also dislikes my sister's fiance.My mum did'nt give a fiddlers fart about his parents anyway and my parents left after about an hour.
At least I'm still good friends with my parents but the relationship with my sister and me is over,she's just
too hurtful and I don't want to be full of bitterness all my life.And it's not a failure on my part if I have no contact with my brother or my sister,as I get older I'll have to start hanging out with people who arnt there to judge and to hurt.
kelkello--you have a right to your feelings about your stepmother. That said, your father obviously loves her, and is probably going through a VERY hard time, so I wouldn't voice your opinion to him, as it won't do any good to hurt him further.

Be there for him as much as possible, but know in your heart that you don't have to feel guilty for your feelings. Your feelings are your own, you have your own reasons for them, and you have a right to them.
coeur ny
help help HELP me!
im 18. my parents are very over protective of where i am (they always have been) and prefer me "home with the family" however when i AM home (most of the time) they prefer i and my younger brother stay away, do our own thing, and then when i DO stay in my room, i'm apparently "mad at the world." anyway, they decided to move four hours away from our old home (where i grew up) this summer and told me i had no options and had to go with them. i wont go into it all, im so sick of it day to day going on and on and on and ooon, but im so unhappy. i want to move home on my own but i have to be sure i can do it first...what did you girls do moving out? how old were you? what (and how much) were your expenses? and did you have a good relationship with your parents before during and after you had moved out?
hi coeur, welcome to BUST!

well, I'm 20, and I've been in my own place for a couple of months now - however, my father still helps pay my rent (I'm at university and my course doesn't allow time for a job, my younger brother also lives with me during school holidays instead of with our father). I pay all my utilities (electricity, gas, water, internet, phone, tv license), food and other bills, as well as a third of my rent. Last year I lived in a shared apartment, but I was lucky enough to find this place for a relatively low rent for the area. I'm in London, so my budget probably wouldn't help, but my total rent, as well as utilities and food probably come to around £850/month or thereabouts. I get on with my mum - she lives overseas - but don't have a lot to do with my dad.

Are you at college or uni? If so, can you stay in halls/dorms - that might be an acceptable "halfway" for you as far as your parents are concerned. Your expenses will rely on what the local rent rates are like - work out what your funds are like (are you working as well as/instead of college?) and then look around to see what you have available in your town. To be honest, you'll be looking at a shared bedsit/studio. Even if you're not in college, if there's a local college that'll be a good place to start looking for available shared housing; if they have a housing office they might offer you some advice on budget.

Talk it over with your parents; do you have a good reason to stay where you are? Have you got friends/friends' parents who'll keep an eye on you? Hope that helps! Stick around, there are plenty of people who'll have much better advice than me.

Good luck Coeur,

I'm just a sometime lurker but hope your situation's really hard (financially) to move out on your own, I found myself in a similar situation to yours and know how stressful it can be.

I first moved away to college at 18 but then transfered to one closer to home at 19 and moved out at 20. I was still in school full time and it was a real struggle to do find a job to pay rent.....I was super lucky that my parents continued to pay my schooling....but everything else, rent, food, utilities, school books, transportation etc I was on my own. I worked my ass off at school ANd my bartending job and it was really hard but it was still better than living at home with my crazy ass dysfunctional family. In fact, I would have done it sooner except that my parents are manipulative and passive agressive so they would say sarcastic things like, "yeah, it's so hard to live with us..." or "if you weren't so angry we would all be happier living together as a familiy," etc etc. And I let it get to me so much that I really began to believe that I was the crazy one, not them. That is one thing I wonder about in your situation: if your parents are so overprotective of you now, would they be accepting of you moving out? Would they cut you off? Like I said, i was real lucky they continued (more or less) to pay for my education...without that, I would have either had to drop out or stay at home. My apartment was slummy and disgusting and infested with silverfish, and I had eight roommates and one single bathroom, but for the most part it was still better than living at home with my family.

Oh, and mornington's suggestions were awesome.
dear coeur: i support your imminent emancipation! i am in a similar boat.
(((persimmon_grrrl)))Don't worry I have known tons of people in your situation, after college. Things will get better. smile.gif

I moved out when after I turned 18. I worked part-time and went to college. I had started working odd jobs when I was 14 and was a pretty dilligent saver so I had a nice sized nest egg to fall back on. But times were rough, I had to have a pretty tight budget, and eventually ended up working full time and taking on roomates to get by. But I am pretty independent, and my family life wasn't exactly nuturing and supportive.
With my mom after you turned 18 you either moved out or got kicked out, so I planned ahead after seeing the struggles my older siblings went through.

But moving out was amazing! I loved being on my own and making my own rules and figuring out how I wanted to live my life. And eventually, I ended up having a better relationship with parents than I ever had when we lived together. (Though it still needs improvement)

Basically, it just weigh all of your options carefully. Housing and utilities vary from state to state, so its hard to let you know. Definately, listen to what mornington suggested. Good luck, coeur ny!
dear ginger_kitty:

thanks so much for your encouragement! i am just going to keep taking action, keep interviewing, and keep on truckin'.

i can't wait to be free!
((((persimmon)))) ouch. it will work out! come in here to vent whenever you need.

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