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gren- I'm with tart on the shock of PB w/o parent's consent. It'd be one thing for a 5 yr old, but a baby? That might have been a deal-breaker for me.

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. There's a big parents meeting for "questions" next week that I think we're going to have to attend. The more we talk about this, the more questions comes up. I understand licensing, and all and am glad the center is very cognizant of it, but to not give guidance besides "send crackers and packaged foods" is crap.

Last night Pizza. We love pizza...all its processed flour, cheesy, pepperoni goodness. One of out last remnants of "bad" food in the diet. Moxette? Spit it out. I think her teeth were bugging her...who WOULDN"T like cheesy, saucy gooey-goodness?
i dunno. they're actually widely lauded statewide and a facility of the college, but they seem pretty clueless about things like that. thanks for the input, tho - i will talk to them about it, as you've given me a reality check that i am not alone in my surprise (i am shocked by most things people feed kids in mainstream america, so i have a sort of auto-censor going on).

i think if i had only three teeth, pizza would be pretty tough for me. also, with a baby's more sensitive palate, pizza can be pretty overwhelmingly salty/seasoned. the bean only likes the bread part. he loves crust.

*enter grenadine, Crusader for Truth*
i love pizza too (so much that i ate an entire small pizza from the yuppie designer pizza place yesterday without mentioning it to my man - left for work w/no lunch and thought i had to do something wink.gif), and i don't mind white flour (actually, i am the big proponent of white flour in my family). i just don't see the reason anyone should eat bleached flour, corn-syrup-filled tomato sauce, hormone-filled milk, and meat toppings that contain antibiotics and growth hormones that have been strongly linked to cancer. i think there's a really sad schism in this country because of the fact that the additives (not just preservatives, but hormones, antibiotics, sugar, nitrates, corn syrup, salt, msg, etc.) that are commonly found in foods have greatly increased. the pizza of our grandparents' day, when mine were making eyes at each other over margherita in north beach, is not the pizza of today, which can have four-six tsp. of added sugar per slice (in the sauce and bread, when there used to be none)!

(and it's interesting to me that the mister, who has severe depression issues, eats tons of high-glycemic-index carbs and hidden corn syrup, which has been linked to both depression and hyperactivity - and that he's noticeably happier on weeks when he's eaten more veggies and less processed junk. kind of like "super size me" on a smaller scale...)

american consumers are being robbed of health by the myth that "if you ask too many questions about ingredients, you're a pinko hippie fascist."
*gets off soapbox*

i am going to make and freeze a ton of pizzas for the mister. i do it with free-range, hormone/antibiotic free pepperoni. i'm not especially looking forward to the labour, but it's spring break soon and we have been eating badly due to lack of time, so hopefully it'll work out.
Wash that box, sista! I'm 99% with you. Pizza is my last holdout. Sometimes, a girl's gotta give in. And eating "bad" food once in a while reinforces the concept of a "treat." I don't really have a problem with french fries from the McD once in a long while either.

What you said, though, is 100% the reason this whole new "food safety" thing at daycare is causing tremors and murmors among our very pinko-hippie community. So, for my lunchbreak, I'm off to trader joes to stock up on some non-nitrate lunchmeat, some cage-free grain fed eggs, some organic zuchinni to make bread with, and bell pepeprs to make some roasted veggie cream cheese spread. really, i just want moxette to know that she can eat what mommy eats and that plain bread, PB and cheese aren't her only options for food.

You know, I lost ALL of the baby weight and 10 more lbs since moxette was born, and i have rarely stepped foot in a gym. That says it all about healthy eating, eh?
tremors and murmurs! oooh...

i think it's great for kids to eat what parents eat. the problem with that for us is that he's allergic to some of it...and initially he seemed to like very plain food (and the other problem is that my work schedule doesn't allow me to cook half the time and the mister doesn't know how...le sigh!). i'm slowly introducing him to adult food, tho. he actually really liked elkburgers (my parents have a farm in the country...there are wild elk...the elk are hormone-free...the mr. has to pretend it is processed cow meat, tho, or he can't choke it down).
tragically, the bean seems to have gone off broccoli. he loved it for six months, but now he just throws it.
gotta be the shape...broccoli SPEAR, right? Little neolithic hunter instinct at play, that's all. Maybe broc soup would be good? You should DEFINITELY talk to the DC, though. If the bean is already food allergic, nuts are an absolute no-no. I'm seafood allergy, and b/c of that, we're holding off on nuts of all sorts until the pediatrician gives us a firm OK.
discussion planned. but shouldn't moxette lay off the strawberries? they're a potent and common allergen.
seafood allergy, wah. my favorite thing.
i was really careful the first couple times i gave them to her. No problems at all. Not with milk either. Actually, its Alge and Shellfish that I'm specifically allergic to. So, I just stay away from anything from the sea.
Oh dear... our first potential "come & get your kid" call from daycare. Tartlet's been pukey all afternoon, enough that they're worried about him. If he throws up again, I'm outta here. Poor monkey. No fever, which is good, but makes me wonder if he ate something off...
Oh tart! Those are the heartwrenchers. We've only had 2, and they were both scary for me. The one other time she was really sick, we just kept her home b/c it was a weekend. Makes all the runny noses seem like lightweight stuff, eh?

Did tartlette get the rotovirus vacciene? I consulted baby 411 and there are some tummy flus that don't have fever, but "food off" generally does. Unless its an allergy.

SIL, get the well!
Your SIL's home safe, well-cuddled, well-nursed & in bed - his tum was singing up a storm, but quieted down after a few shots of gripe water. Still no fever, just super sleepy & fussy, so I'm chalking it up to a version of the icks that are currently decimating my office staff... Poor monkey, he was sooooooo tired... We'll see how he fares overnight - we've got double sheet action on the crib, teatree oil in the humidifier, & Lamby tucked in beside him, so I think we've got bases covered... Off to get dinner, and LOST - woo!
tart, it occurs to me that we haven't seen any photos of my SIL recently...standing, walking, c'mon! We have some new ones up just last night. My kiddo, teeth ickies and all...standing on her own! WHOOT! Then, we had a little tumble and lots of, i take what i can get.
Oh. My. Goodness. "Winter Princess"? You slay me, Mox... and what's with the Kirklands packages? Do they infuse them with baby crack or something? We have several half-empties scattered around the house for the sole purpose of entertaining Tartlet... Yay, walking Moxette!

We've been so, so lax about taking photos the past month or so - there's a couple of new ones up, but you're right - no documentation of bipedal locomotion. We'll have to rectify that this weekend, for sure, especially now The Cart has arrived...

So it's all sunshine & lollypops this morning - one fidgety wake-up around 3:30, and then a good, long sleep-in in the big bed... Tartlet woke up in one of the best moods I've witnessed, big smiles & cuddles & peek-a-boo with the covers... Needless to say, I was late to work laugh.gif
um, moxieman comes up with the captions. I'm mostly the photographer. I put pics up b/c i got the most viscious email from my sister, who lives away. "Um, yeah, i think my niece is bigger than at your birthday, but I don't really know b/c someone hasn't posted any pictures in 2 months." Ok, point taken.
Hee Hee Prader-Willi syndrome!!
Cboy is definitely on the picky eater side. I've written down some of your suggestions to try. It's frustrating, because what he eats on Monday he'll turn down on Thursday. Sigh.
I'm impressed by all the food suggestions, too.

Chani, I watch entirely too much reality tv medical type programming. When I lived in England it was on constantly and I loved it all. Down side=feeds into hypochondria.

(on the plus side, my medical geekdom--ie, I have a geek like interest in just about anything medical--did have a very positive result on at least one occasion. Ok, more than one, but one esp. notable one. I had a vaginal fissure a number of years ago that mysteriously appeared and would. not. heal.

I did everything the doctor said to do. I even happened to see a gyno for a chronic pelvic pain problem--which turned out to be an ovarian cyst rather than the post PID adhesions everyone was expecting--and he just gave me a combo steroid and antifungal cream, which did no good at all.

I looked up everything I could find and found nothing. Finally, one day I was reading a book I'd checked out of the library called The Harvard Guide to Women's Health. Yep, just reading it for fun. In that I came across the sentence "Chronic yeast infections can sometimes cause vaginal fissures."

In all my years of reading this kind of thing I'd never read it before. My GP and my gyno didn't mention it. I put two and two together--that after about 2 years of taking BC pills I tended to get chronic very low grade yeast infections--stopped taking the pill, and after 6 weeks the fissure was gone. It had been there for months before that.

Ok, major digression, but I guess it's on my mind lately. I'm hoping the gyno will have some similar miracle easy cure for my perineal woes....)

The boy is finally asleep. He's going to sleep a lot easier these days (most of the time). He used to just cry and writhe and seem to just fight sleep. The more tired he was the more miserable and the more he fought.. Now it's so much easier. He was up at 6 am today, however. I left him while he cooed for 45 minutes, but he was clearly not going back to sleep so we both got up. I was pleased he was able to entertain himself for so long--another major new development.

Before he went to sleep he was practicing his favorite new thing-screeching--then laughing at himself or at me when I did it back to him.

Mox, great pictures. I love yours and tart's ever changing avatar pics

(And we have the same rocking chair toy thingy. He really loves it.)
Ok, I killed the thread with talk of my front bottom (as my friend Sonja calls it.)

I promise not to do it again.*

The boy is sleeping for about 7-8 hours at a stretch! He goes to sleep about 8 or 9pm, wakes up somewhere around 4 for a feed, and then goes back to sleep for a couple of hours. Amazing. It was *boom!* all of a sudden when we started the cereal at night, though I know it's his maturing brain, too.

*ok, I probably will mention it again after the gyno appt, to be honest.
Annoush- whatever it was, KEEP DOING IT! YEAH NOT BOB!

I'm sorry, your front-butt didn't keep me away. We had another busy, busy weekend here in moxieland. It was SO gorgrous outside, we were at the local parks alot, and had a good time going to a local eatery saturday night, where another bebe just moxette's age was at the next table. The 2 silly girls were mimicking each other! Cracked my shite up. Then, at a family tete-a-tete last evening, we introduced ice cream. Holy goodness...demanding little kidlet! At least I know the cack and ice cream at her b-day will be a hit!

So, i was gonna be all "hardcore" and start weaning moxette off this early AM bottle (was at 4 originally, now somewhere between 5 and 6). She's almost 1 year old, and she doesn't "need" it. I just couldn't do it. COuldn't let myself hear her this morning at 5:15 "nana? nanananana?" In her world, "nananana" is both bannana (her favorite food at the moment) and by extension, any food. I finally went in, and she looks at me, says "nana, mama?" OK, i get it. YOU'LL tell ME when you're ready. Got it.
Seriously, Anoushh, that's fantastic - what a difference a good night's sleep makes, eh? And your front bottom is hardly the thread killer - we had an... eventful weekend. Tartman had a raging case of what I suspect was food poisoning, so I bailed on my class & did lots of laundry & made Gatorade runs & entertained boy-o while Daddy was puking his guts out for 12 hours straight. By yesterday afternoon, though, we were all fit to get out of the house, and went for some miso soup & a spin on the swings at the park - big, big fun, lots of giggles. So a crap weekend (literally), but lots of good moments.

So, anyone else got a scaly baby? Tartlet's got these patches of dry skin along his ribs - they're not red at all, just a bit rough, but they aren't responding to much of anything I put on them (regular lotion, Eucerin, J&J Soothing Balm, A&D). They don't seem to be bothering him, or getting markedly bigger...

It's funny, isn't it, Mox? We can be all business, but one little "nanana?" and we go to pieces - Tartlet was having a fitful night, and woke up with a whimper and a "nenene... nenenene?...nenene?" (our 'word' for nursing) Poor wuzzums...
tart- moxette gets mild ezema on her legs when the weather changes rapidly. Our doc told us to moisturize, moisturize, moisturize. If that doesn't work, try 1% hydrocortizone cream in the morning and after bathtime. And moisturize, etc. We just use regular vaseline's intensive care. Seems to do the trick.

yeah, I have to remember that we've provided the structure for her, and she will grow and thrive and tell me what i need to do for her within that. After all, she did eventually push the midnight bottle away all on her own.

tart- what's your plan for the 1 yr old "switch" to whole milk? I have about 3 weeks of formula left...i was thinking of getting a pint of whole milk to intro slowly with the sippy cup. We're down to bottles just at nap and bedtime (technically, i think of the 5am as a very early mornuing nap)...sippys at meals and snacks.
We still rely so heavily on bottles for Tartlet's eating - solids, even 3x a day, are more fun than profit - so I think we'll keep up with the formula for another few months. He's still at the low end of his weight chart (30% & holding), so the extra calories & whatnot wouldn't be a bad thing for us. Once we get to that stage, though, I think we'll start diluting formula with whole milk bit by bit, either in the bottle or in a cup. Sippy progress is very slow here - I think we may just go straight for the table cup, and get ponchos for everyone...

That's a whole other discussion - weaning, both bottle & boob. I always said I'd nurse for a year, or until there were teeth - we're verging on both, and I can't imagine stopping now. It's my only guaranteed silver bullet when naps aren't happening, or we're fried, or it's the middle of the night & we're battling the Gas Attack from Hell. (sigh) I'm such a pusscake. I'm so used to being able to stifle a screaming fit with a swift boob to the head, that the mere idea of having to work it out sans boob is just exhausting. If he took a paci, I'd find the whole process much, much less daunting...
tart- i know we aren't boobcentric here, but until just a month or two ago, we were that way with the bottle. I will absolutely testify (and I think Chani could agree) that sucking your own fear up, trusting the framework you set up will work and let go. tartlette has a lovie and is comfortable in his room. If he is a cranky pants b/c he doesn't get a nap, his body will eventually kick over his stubborn-ness. Then, as my doc says, "be stubborn, more stubborn than the baby." The "time" to do it is so different for everyone. This, of course, is where tartman at 2am will come in super handy. Of course, in the long run, you'll miss it much more than tartlette. (and hence why i melted at the morning's "nananana").

Our neighbors have an almost 2-yrold, totally bottle fed, and he finally was "totally" bottle weaned at about 20 mos. My cousin's 2 girls- both off bottles by their first birthdays. I suspect we'll be somewhere between 15 and 18 mos for the last of them to go.
I didn't really thing I was the thread killer. I'm not that egocentric, honest. (Though I did consider it might be TMI.)

Anyway, food poisoning or whatever is was sounds awful, Tart.

The scaly patches sound like they could be psoriasis. I know that a former coworker who had it said she started getting it as a baby. You might look up something about that and see if it looks like it matches.

I love the reports of early baby words. When did they start?

Notbob loooovvvesss his pacifier. I wasn't even planning on having any (I really don't know why now) but he set us straight.

One of the hardest things to do in the rough patches is to trust in yourself and the baby's natural growth and that they will tell you what they need (eventually, anyway), isn't it?

I have a question myself about night time stuff. He is sleeping for longer periods and usually not fighting the sleep as much, but the waking period at 4 am (or so) is often problematic. He seems like he's ready to go to sleep after he eats, but then will start kicking his legs like he's got gas. This often eventually wakes him up and we are in for a bit of a prolonged "back to sleep" transition again. He doesn't sleep past 7, usually six, so it makes a difference.

Anyway, all I can think of is gas drops before bed (which I keep forgetting to try, so haven't yet.) Any other ideas?
gripe water at bedtime and 4am feeding. A dash in the bottle, all the difference. Then, let him fuss a bit...the kicking lets get the gas out. When moxette was at that stage, we did a 5-10 min walk around after the bottle, and it helped alot, too. And, I read somewhere about clipping the paci to the baby at night...i don't have any practical advice there, though. Moxette never liked the paci, no matter how much we wanted her to.

Um, words. The babble was somewhere around 5-6 mos. "Words" (kitty was her first real one!) was about 8 mos. Now, at 11.5 mos, we definitely have "mama," "dada," "no" (although she just shakes her head...we try not to use the NO word much here) and "ananna", which as I noted earlier, started out as "banana" but now means pretty much "FEED ME." She understands and points at just about all the vocabulary we put in front of her, though. I'm trying to use action words often: "Moxette, UP" "Moxette, EAT", etc.
(a la John Lovitz as the Devil) Dance, Moxette, dance! laugh.gif

We, too, have an antsypants at night, Anoushh. Sometimes it's obviously gas, but a lot of times it's like my dad's restless leg syndrome - more compulsive thrashing, like some kind of hardcore punk self-soothing technique, legs a'flailing, punching himself in the head, arching the back... Some nights I can basically pin him down (with love! with love, I swear!), with one arm tucking his legs up close & the other hugging round to cover his outside arm. I still get picked & pinched to death sometimes, though. Other nights, I just put him on the floor & let him cruise around until he's obviously ready to give it another try - usually only 5-10 minutes, at most.

Psoriasis, eh? (off to WebMD...)
Hey other hip mommas! I just joined today (hence lack of avatar or any other fancy shmancy siggies or pics)...greetings...

I'm a married, although unhip as of late, momma in Michigan -- and I think I have finally stumbled upon a forum where I might actually fit in! I am a work-at-home momma to a very crazy 17-mth-old very bodacious boy. I realize as I'm typing this that it all sounds quite waspy and in my real life I have to play the part, but I feel I can just be me here (um, correct ladies if I'm wrong)...'s my question of the day...and forgive me in advance if this has been shopped around a million times...I'm in love with my hubby, sex is great actually, but I am a habitual masturbator. There I've said it. I love it. I love my hitachi magic wand (don't ever leave me!), I'm constantly trying to find the privacy to really just fuck that thing silly (oh my, what language!). Back to my question -- I'm not bisexual (but I did do a little fooling around in college, oh those were the days), but if I weren't married I'd probably be all about the pussy. There I said it again. I guess masturbating is the only time I really feel free -- free to fantasize and watch lovely boobies and fingers sliding up and down. So I do it all the time...well, as much as I can I the only one? And I guess because now that I'm a momma I *should* be in check and keep myself grounded and etc. But my gosh I'd just love to find a group of gals to masturbate with -- is that so wrong! I'd never cheat on hubby, nor would he be into it at all (he's very conservative), but I'd love to just be in a group of other gals who love to love themselves -- free to be you and me (obscure 70s reference to us in our 30s)...

Ah well, back to real life...
We're almost at 20 months now, and the bottle rarely makes an appearance (unless Dad is too lazy to wash a sippy cup). This morning, tho, babe was up early fussing and I've had the flu and he hadn't eaten much the night before, so I gave him a bottle and he slept for another 2.5 hours!!! Now he's been overtired for a couple of days, and obviously needed a catchup but, dude, my mom's not kidding calling the occasional bottle a "sanity saver"!
And of course, moxie's right. Thus far I've found that sucking it up and implementing the desired change usually goes far more smoothly than I anticipate. I like how she described "trusting the framework" - because despite our misgivings, we know our babies and what they're ready for and how to achieve that within their tempraments. The most recent example of that for us was the switch to toddler bed, which went remarkably well.
Metoo - welcome! By the way you signed off "back to real life" I suspect you know the answer to your question! You've made a committment to your partner that I suspect precludes sexual experiences with other partners by your description of him and his possible reactions. I don't think being a mom changes that! Do you use lesbian porn to masturbate? Could you and your husband be comfortable enjoying that together?
CHani, what about the transition to whole moo from formula? should we wait until after her 1 yr appt or start now? chani- is the toddler bed on the floor, or up high like a regular twin would be?

metoo- I'm from the D! 313? 248? West side stater? Sorry...there are a lack of MI busties, IMO. The masturbation quesiton prob. belongs more in the "let your hands do the walking" thread, as we tend to chat about our kidlets and related challenges here...but, I also second chani's wise words. Having a kidlet has actually increased my sense of sexuality, and really clarified my own ability to tell my husband what i enjoy, etc. I think its the "time is precious" concept.

We hit a major milestone last night, ladies, one I thought we'd never see, at least not this early... Tartlet has nursed to sleep his entire tiny life. On occasion, we've been able to bounce/rock/dance him to sleep at night, but only rarely, and only after an hour or so of backbreaking work.

Last night was shaping up to be another doozey - he nursed fine for a bit, but then started up with the picking & fidgeting again. I finally packed up the boob & just parked him on my lap, and let him yammer away. ("Ba! Ba! BAAAA! Dododododo! Ba!" The kid clearly had something to get off his mind...) After 10 minutes, he squirmed around, played with my hair a bit, and put his head on my arm. I stroked his hair for a few minutes, he stared off into space a bit, then closed his eyes, heaved a great big sigh, and zonked. 5 minutes later I put him in the crib, where he smushed his face into his stuffed lamb & started snoring.

Cut to me, doing a silent "GOOOOOOOOAAAAAL" dance around his room laugh.gif This is incredible. You have no idea how happy this makes me. This means that we have a door, however tiny, to weaning - it's been the getting to sleep at night part that's been the sticking point in our plans. I don't care if he doesn't do it reliably, or even again for a few months - the point is, he CAN.

Ahhhhhh. I don't dread bedtime by any stretch, but it was so nice to just watch him drift off without having to chew on my nipple to do it.

Welcome, Meetoo - I have very little to contribute to your situation, as my sex drive is on extended leave in Ibiza... or is it Togo? Somewhere far, far away, anyway, with no estimated date of return... dry.gif
tart! what a wonderful development!!! All the "books" say to do just what tartlette did last night...nurse/bottle, get relaxed and then put down to sleepytime. We got to that point (where she would fall asleep w/o her baba in the mouth) around 10.5 mos. I'm still amazed.

Poor moxette had drool-related smoker's cough last night and required a bit of mommy dance at 2am. I try really hard to let her work though these upsets at night by herself...and she's 95% there. I figure the other 5%, her mama is a good source of cuddles. Hell, I was 20 and still getting nightmare where I wanted my mama!
Mox- I'm in the D too! 248 actually, so kinda northwest of downtown. I agree that there is a sad showing of MI Busties, wonder why...

Also, to address Metoo: I'm in the same boat as tart. My libido must be on the same extended vacation as yours... Perhaps it's part of the nursing? Or just sleep deprivation? Hopefully, it'll make it's way back home soon. smile.gif
i dunno...three of you guys seems like a lot to me, compared to the rest of us...
tart, hurrah for unassisted sleep initiation!

metoo, you might want to visit the "boys? girls? both?" thread as well. as you may have learnt if you've read into this thread, it tends to chat a lot about diaper rash and not so much about le sexe.

and my libido is also sunning itself in vanuatu. i don't even care...but i suspect the primary reason is overwork and not child-rearing, since it's a relatively new development.
jas, really? I'm SO a 248! I work downtown, but live north-ish. So, I just didn't KNOW there were, ok? I guess, like all things Detroit, I was cowed by the chicago-core of busties, my dearest Tart included.

Since it was like 70 and sunny yesterday, we did the connsumate midwestern ritual...early spring grilling and outside play. It was WONDERFUL. All our neighbors were out, and moxette was a true riot-act, making flirty faces everywhere. This, of course, so long as moxieman or i was holding her. smile.gif She also experienced grass for the first time. Awesome. Today, back to early spring crap-ola weather. We had 1 day, though.

Ok, so the cereal is totally helping him sleep.

Last night giving him cereal didn't work out. Result--several wakings and I'm exhausted. He, however, was up at 7. blink.gif
We had a restless night, as well, Anoushh - hurts, doesn't it? (yawn) I chalk it up to spring fever...

So Tartman was talking to one of the daycare ladies this morning, and she revealed this bombshell: Tartlet no longer requires pillowtime/buttpatting/whathaveyou to go down for a nap. He gets sleepy, she takes him upstairs to the Sleep Room, tucks him into bed, and off to sleep he goes.

I love my little man to pieces, he is the light of my life, but.... fucker. We do that and he screams like we're pulling his toenails out. I so want to sit him down tonight & say "Look, the gig is up. We're on to you. How's about we just cut to the chase here & you can go to sleep for us like you do for daycarelady, huh? In exchange, you can eat a can of cherry puffs a day. Deal?"
Ah, the old "they know they can act differently for different adults" routine, eh? The SIL has your number, babe. It will be hard, but try less "he has to be asleep" and more "relaxed" at home this weekend (i'd hate to try something new on a weeknight!) and see what happens. I"m curious, how long does he scream at home? like 1/2 hour? or 10 min? one is hard, one is intolerable...hmmm...we also have a monologue for moxette every night at bedtime, which is modified for naps. I say this, and I have no doubt i curse myself for tonight.
Ha, ha, ha Tart! Isn't that just infuriating?! When I figured out that if left alone, Chaniboy's 20 minutes of howling anguish was often followed by a figurative shrug of the shoulders and falling asleep happily on his own and all of us waking up fresh and happy the next morning.... well... it changed the routine a bit!
His toddler bed is a crib mattress on the floor with a frame around the head of it. So he gets bath and book/cuddles and a monologue, I put him down in bed with his soother and shut the door. Some nights he's asleep right away, some nights he gets out of bed and stands at the door banging on it with his soother and crying. Most of those nights it lasts about 2-5 min and if left alone he'll toddle back into bed and sleep. If he's fussier then we ferber. We've found that if we do extended cuddles, he wants to play, then he gets all wound up and hysterical and doesn't sleep at all!
The formula to whole milk thing was seamlessly accomplished by just mixing them together in the bottle. No probs!
I don't have a way to derive a name yet for my little person from my name so from here on out she's referred to as "the button". Oh and she's about to turn 8 mos(some of you I remember from the preg thread, though you may not remember me).

Oh and I'm in Chicago. I thought I saw someone else say they were.

Ok, now that we've got that established:

oy, the sleeping thing. Yeah, Button can fall asleep for dad when I'm not around sometimes. But she'll only go down via nursing with me. I want my boobs and my sleep back! Now! arrghh

She spent all last week waking up six times at night, thrashing and what not. Because our place is small her crib is in our room so of course my husband is the worst and up every time she makes a peep in the middle of the night. So he hands her to me and I nurse her, she falls asleep on me and then she wakes, fumbles for the nip, and this becomes our dance til she decides we're FINALLy getting up.

Every once in a rare while she sleeps through the night 8 hours or so, but the last ten days are starting to hurt me. I have an almost ten yr old and I tell ya, he's starting to hate me for my crankiness.

Anyways, other then that button ate hummus on pita bread today and it freaked me out. She more or less grabbed it from me. She LOVED it! I let her have more and she ate it up furiously. This one is going to be a much better eater then her brother. Though that was my fault, I was an idiot way back then. I can admit that now. haha

Metoo-My sex drive took the skyway after Button was born but came back furiously about two mos ago. I think it coincided with my menses returning. Anyways, the only problem is that it's not always possible/convenient and my ability to have an orgasm before my husband also isn't possible. Plus I don't have any "friends" and told him after an especially umm hard session the other night( I told him afterwards, slooower, not so hard dear) he's buying me something this week.
(((tart))) I thought of you at 4am mommy dance this morning. It is HARD, harder on us, I think. Eventually, her cough subsided enough for me to not worry, and down she went, looking almost relieved to be back in bed. I've had the same experience as Chani for the last month or two...too much cuddles post-bottle, and she thinks its playtime again. I kind of miss it, but I do also know she's growing into an independent little girlie.

SO, as an independent little girlie, we have decided to give her a "kid's" room (as opposed to infant-here's your changing table...please sleep for her 1st birthday. Mostly, arising out of my desire to organize her toys, but still...her space should reflect her needs, so we're moving on up. We never really "decorated" her room when she ws born, either. SO, posit the question- what would YOU do for a good "kid's" room? So far, we've got chaulkboard paint for the closet door, and some ideas about animals and letter stuff for wall hangings...any other inspired ideas? We have an IKEA about 30 min away...and will probably go there for the organization stuff.
Oof. We went to a Very Bad Place last night, and I'm still beating myself up over it... We nursed down for bed, all was well, but he woke up once I put him in the crib. For some godforsaken reason I decided on the spur of the moment that we were done nursing for the night, and that I'd just cuddle him back to drowsy instead of just popping him back on the boob for 5 minutes.

45 minutes of full-body, clawing, kicking, ear-splitting, screaming-down-the-house hysteria later, I got my head out of my ass and nursed him. He was out in 2 minutes.

Of course, he's fine & happy & completely unfazed this morning, but I'm in the throes of big time Mama Guilt. What the hell was I thinking? And what possessed me to let him go that long, knowing it wasn't working? Not a proud moment, and one I'll be keeping in my mind as an example of what not to let happen again. Gah. It's a control thing, I know. Every other aspect of my life I can either totally call the shots on, or if not, then at least have some semblance of a workable game plan. Motherhood is handing my ass to me on a plate, making me face up to the fact that not everything can be reasoned out with A Plan.


(Hi, Charli! Tartlet's a big fan of hummus, too - I figure as long as the salt's not out of control, a little doesn't hurt them...)
tart- i was right there with you at 4am, sista. 45 minutes of drool-coughing, and I finally told myself "hey, she needs her mother".

Don't feel guilty for trying something different, though. Parenthood is about trial and error...that's how we figure out what works and what doesn't. Eventually, you'll be ready to negotiate more with tartlette, and he'll be ready to accept it. BTW, where was the Mr. during all this? The "down for the night" thing takes a week or two, at least, of incremental stretches of time to work, imo.

I give you KUDOs for trying something new. I've never been able to go more than 10 min w/o intervening, either. Maybe a better first step is to nurse, but not let him in bed with you anymore? A middle ground, perhaps?

This sleep-control-who-is-in-control is murder.
((sleep-deprived moms)) I don't know how you do it!

I thought y'all would be interested in this article.
holy goodness! I suddenly don't feel even the least little bit of guilt for not breastfeeding. That poor woman.
Thanks for the support, Mox - for the record, all this screaming was in my arms, not alone in the crib, so it's marginally less awful... and yet more so, as I got to witness the total panic & confusion up close & personal-like... Tartman stuck his head around the corner when the ruckus first started, and I told him I wanted to work this one out myself - I made the snap decision, and Tartman has a much, much lower threshold for full-bore screaming in his ear than I do.

He's actually not in bed with us much at all anymore - I've taken to using the couch in the middle of the night, and putting him back in his crib once he drifts off again. When he was sick, co-sleeping saved our bacon, but lately it's been an exercise in frustration for all involved - lots of fidgeting, popping on & off, my hips get sore, Tartman snores & wakes everyone up... We're all getting more sleep now that we're in our own beds.

I'm looking forward to the time when Tartlet is able to listen to reason - when "Tartlet goes night-night, Mama goes night-night, nenes go night-night" might actually have some impact...

ETA: Ugh. Poor woman, and poor baby! Thanks for that Polly, if only to give me some perspective on how horrible things could be....
tart, honestly, if you really are ready for "independent" sleeping (such as it is), try 2, then 5, then 10 minute intervals a few nights apart. Be firm, but don't push things beyond your own comfort level. I resorted to the bottle by about 3 10-minute intervals (or the rough equivalent thereof) of cuddles, night-night for the first few nights, then it got longer and longer in between crying...eventually, she was golden. Or the multi-ethnic genetic stew might be. AND, crying alone in the crib for short intervals isn't punishment or torture for them. I swear. They''re just pissed off. Everyone gets to be pissed off from time to time.

And, get tartman to help...doing every-other night duty saved our collective sanity. That being said, tartlette needs the confidence and seriousness from you to be able to do it, too. SO, don't go there until you're really ready yourself.

My mother just told me a rocking story about my brother's recent antics...I'm pretty sure that they never listen to reason!

In other's getting ready for the move?!?
They''re just pissed off. Everyone gets to be pissed off from time to time.

You are so right, Mox. I just have to get over my own insecurities about Tartlet (or anyone else I care about) being pissed at ME.

We're knee-deep in boxes, at that miserable stage where it feels like we've made no real progress, just a colossal mess. Once we get a charity shop pick-up, we'll feel a lot better, I think - it'll free up a few chunks of space that will allow for more organized box-stacking.

My folks are getting ready to move, as well, and my mum's trying to simultaneously micromanage both their move & ours. rolleyes.gif She emailed my FIL the other day to remind him to get the car title transferred over before we get there. For his car. That he's giving us. That has what to do with her? Sheesh.

I think at this point we're going to shelve any big changes in Tartlet's sleep until we move. A new house, a new room (we're with you on the kid's room ponderings, Mox), new sleep habits, right? I, for one, am looking forward to watching movies at full volume again... the intimacy of apartment living has officially lost its luster.
(ETA: rant re the article) yeah...and you have to give in when the kid wants to nurse all night? that exact story happened to a friend of mine, but it was a clear case of "disorganized, inconsistent, doesn't get clear messages," on the parenting side. i introduced the bottle (i forgot when...whenever the experts said it was smartest to do so) and we had no problem. once or twice he refused a bottle until i got home, but he just got his regular nursing and realised he'd better accept one right quick! of course, the bean was also on an eating schedule, so if it was 3 p.m. and i wasn't there, he was like "milk time" anyway. i don't even feel sorry for parents like that...i feel sorry that they don't realise their parenting choices have consequences, but mostly i think this is the kind of "scare story" mothers who enjoy having something to complain about (and there are a lot of people who seem to think that motherhood is one big long complaining competition) use to get points. grrr. my friend ended up sleeping on the couch while her kid screamed and then giving in and nursing (mind you, kid was FAT and healthy - no nourishment worries here). which is her choice as a parent, but i'll be damned if i think there's any interest in or justification for an article about it.

also ETA: and that article is enough to give anyone the impression that breastfeeding is onerous, awful, and involves BEING CONTROLLED BY YOUR BABY, when in reality those statements describe that woman's parenting choices, not a feeding choice.

and where is it written that it's okay for us to assume that this woman's experience is somehow 'representative' of the horrors of breastfeeding or that the mere choice to breastfeed means you have a certain parenting philosophy? that's as ignorant and short-sighted as if i were to assume that ALL women who choose to bottle-feed are a certain way...and the stereotype is not complimentary (and would be a huge disservice to what i know of mox, anoushh, etc.). can't we move beyond those stereotypes?

tart, sorry about the sleep loss...don't beat yourself up. sometimes we're all ready to swoop into a decision the babe isn't ready for.
Gren, what a hella good set of points about the article! WHat bugs me most about "Parenting" is the concept that its a CHORE all the time, not a new part of a lifestyle that is 90% fun and rewarding. Funny story (in the genuinely most-ironic story of all time awards genere). Summer 2005, moxieman is standing up in a wedding. We had been TTC for about 5 months. All the other groomsmen were young parents (well, parents of babies), and in typical, bullshit male fashion, were BEMOANING parenthood. "Get ready for your own life to end." "Forget anything you ever enjoyed doing". "Kiss your wife goodbye" bullshite. Well, moxieman got right scared, and he was freaked out enough that we decided to hold off another six months and just enjoy ourselves. 2 weeks later...the positive test. Yep, you counted right, we GOT PREGNANT the night we decided to stop trying. Heh.

THe long point is, we later realized these guys were all debbie downer types to start with, with harpy wives and/or really problematic kids (a premie at 30 weeks with lots of medical issues). OUr experience in parenting hasn't always been a treat, and we certainly weren't prepared for the emotional onslaugt of new-born-ness, but overall, Parenting is a really great experience. We made some rather un-orthodox choices that were rooted in our own knowledgee of ourselves, and as a result, have a really quite happy, stable family life.

THis brings me to the next topic of conversation- the maternal sex drive. I feel like a bragging shite, but my sex drive has been spectacular since the baby's birth. Mostly, the sex has been spectacular. Not nearly as often as before baby, but about 100% better. So, I'm wondering if I have accepted that my sexuality is just all about quality, not quantity, and becomming a mother made me accept that and be happy with it. COnversely, if (tart?) sex isn't imporant or desired post-bebe, was the sex drive more or less "just there" and not critically strong before bebe, and becomming a mother has let you accept your own "self?" Does that even make sense? We're into critical self-analysis these days, as 1 year of parenting approaches fast. mom sounds funny. Kinda irritating, but in the funny way.
i think there are some people, women in particular, who think that if they don't constantly complain people will think they have it too easy or aren't working hard enough. my friend is like that, and so is her mom. not that parenting is ever easy, so i wonder why they bother, but whatever. it's a pernicious habit, if you ask me. pernicious and ill-mannered.

i think maybe that's your personal journey re: sex drive, mox. mine was the same as before for a while (eight months? ten months?) after the bean was born. it has sharply declined in recent months. i think this has everything to do with other aspects in life (my work level, my stress level, my frustration with various things that are not sex related).
but i do hear a lot of women say they 'don't have drive' or 'don't have time' for sex after the baby is born, and i think there are many complicated issues at play. for one, a lot of women don't get a second to themselves due to unfair labor distribution/life circumstances (being single moms, for example), so mox, you can consider yourself lucky that you've been able to create a parenting life that does involve some you-time and couple-time (thanks in no small part to the enthusiastic grands, i'm sure).

you may be right, gren. sorry i brought it up. sad.gif
sorry i'm being scary, mox...gren has her crabbypants on today, i'm afraid! sad.gif i wasn't trying to imply that you'd said anything amiss, just that i'm not sure about the whole global-connection-of-motherhood-to-sex life idea. there are just so many other factors. i can think of a half-dozen people i know who might have the same story to tell as you if they had an involved partner and some more support, but that doesn't mean the reality (they had no sex drive after motherhood) implies a causal relationship. it would be hard to accept yourself and become sexually fulfilled while single parenting a newborn, for example...but don't be sorry. i think it's awesome that this experience has brought you a better sex life.
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