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> Yeast infection--experienced advice, anyone?
mouse
post Mar 1 2008, 12:48 AM
Post #41


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motherFUCK, ladies, i think i have a goddamn fucking yeast infection for the first time in my goddamn fucking life! i HATE antibiotics!!!!! seriously, as soon as i finished the prescription it hit me. WHYYY

ok so, i think this MUST be a yeast infection because it makes perfect sense, i luckily pretty much never have issues with my bits and now when it would be most likely, i am having an issue. my cooze is really painful and feels super dry, even though it's pretty much the same moistness as always. i don't itch and i don't have any discharge, i just feel really tight and hurty and dry inside and outside. perfect timing, too, since the first boy who has expressed any sort of interest in me in like six months is possibly gonna be around this weekend. CRAPPITY CRAP CRAP.

so, here is the question i pose to you intelligent ladies from my spot here on the couch, sitting in some yogurt--should i take an OTC for this? or should i see if yogurt and garlic and whatnot clear it up? i'm taking probiotics anyway. i just don't want this to become a recurring thing, and i am curious whether OTCs will make that more or less likely. also, it's definitely bearable--it's uncomfortable, but it's not the kind of thing where it's the only thing i can think about.

it would be great to get some opinions on this. hope you and all your respective coozes are in top form.


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chachaheels
post Feb 27 2008, 09:27 PM
Post #42


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I don't it's that men are asymptomatic for yeast, it's that the symptoms are not "recognized" as part of the conventional definition of yeast infections. Yeast infections are actually systemic in nature, and not local, though their most famous symptoms appear to be local only (and, as theartist knows, they're not). For men I look for symptoms of itchiness anywhere in the body--usually it will be deep in the ear canal, sometimes in the mouth (look for thrush symptoms) and often in skin symptoms (they get the itchiness and redness in the genital area and also in other parts of the party where there is a tendency to dampness and darkness. Feet, for example. After all, athlete's foot is just another fungal infection, like "yeast"). Babies and children are prone to yeast infections as well (diaper rash and indeed a large number of the early rashes babies get are systemic yeast).

This is why localized symptoms "pass back and forth" between partners; and why "localized" symptoms are only what they appear to be, when in reality they are symptoms of an overall tendency for the body to become susceptible to fungal infections. Just because the discharge "clears up", doesn't mean the yeast infection is gone.

That's why the white discharge and itchiness and pain associated with vaginal yeast almost always occurs during the time of hormonal fluctuation just before the period begins, and seems to "clear up" once the flow begins. Only to recur next cycle, right on time. All the systems of the body are affected by the fungal infection--the digestive, reproductive, lymphatic, and immune systems are affected, just to name a few. The same systems are affected in men when they experience yeast, too.


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kittenb
post Feb 27 2008, 08:04 AM
Post #43


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theartist - I don't think that is a bad idea at all. As I understand it men can get yeast infections they are just asymptomatic. However, they can pass it back to you.
Good luck!


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theartist
post Feb 26 2008, 12:57 AM
Post #44


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Hi, I stumbled upon this forum and page randomly, when searching for help with this yeast issue.

Back in September of last year, I had to take a penicillin-based antibiotic for a urinary tract infection. My doctor told me that, even though I'd never had a yeast infection before, I could very well get one with this antibiotic. Well, turns out he was right. I know it seems odd that I am posting now, nearly five months later, but it only hit me today that what I've been experiencing is a yeast infection. I've been getting terrible itching, redness, slight swelling and a light, white discharge a week before each of my periods. I just thought my hormones were doing something wacky, because it went away as soon as my period hit! I'm guessing one of the reasons it came and went like this is that I am, in general, quite healthy and take probiotics.

Today, I've gone to the pharmacy and gotten a 6-day pessary Canesten (Lotrimin) treatment, as per the pharmacist's recommendation. I'll be eating lots of good yoghurt and trying something I saw on Earth Clinic (http://www.earthclinic.com -- great site), which consists of one taking 2tbsp. of lime juice, a 1/2 tsp. of baking soda and a 1/2 cup of water together. According to one of the very informative visitors of that site, it will get your pH back on track.

I'm wondering, should my boyfriend (we are monogamous and live together) go to a doctor to make sure he hasn't gotten this off me? We use condoms as contraceptive, so I'm not too concerned, but considering my infection has primarily featured an outer rash on the labia and things--areas that would touch skin and hands, obviously--might he need to be concerned? He hasn't noticed any changes anywhere on his body. Thanks!
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chachaheels
post Feb 22 2008, 04:40 AM
Post #45


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Mouse, Annelise found a very good, high microbe count acidophilus and bifidus probiotic formulation that is available in health food stores to the consumer, she's got a photo of it, below. If you can find that, use it!! If you can find Genestra Seroyal's HMF Replete and use that for a week after, that's good too. I think both of these products are made for people who find themselves stuck on a prescription they know will end in yeast. To get over that, the yogurts and over the counter daily probiotics just won't do.

Antibiotics are extremely deadly to a wide range of microorganisms in the body--that's why yeast infections result from their use. You have to be aggressive about replacing beneficial microorganisms the anti-biotics kill off. I would take a very high count formulation AFTER you've finished with the antibiotic. Though it may seem like a wise thing to put yogurt on a panty liner or insert it in the vagina (Neurotic.nelly's suggestion is a good one, it can be soothing, especially if you're feeling the symptoms externally!) you need to replace what's being killed off in your gut. We're not playing chemical bombs here, like there's a "war", you vs. yeast; we're actually replacing what your own body would have in abundance, if it hadn't made unhealthy by the antibiotics. Then, your own body can continue to maintain the beneficial balance of yeast and bacterial culture that's needed to keep you well.

In the meantime, the kombuchas and kvasses and lactofermented foods of all kinds will be a big help while you're taking the anti-biotics. They can minimize the impact of the drug while you're taking it.

Konphusion, thanks for posting that detailed account, that gives people an idea about quantities used, and length of time to use the boric acid. I'm sure this is the easiest solution, particularly if pessaries are hard to find or if they're priced way out of reach of simply not readily accessible without a prescription. Your advice is going to be really helpful to a lot of women!


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neurotic.nelly
post Feb 22 2008, 12:56 AM
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mouse, i've heard that you can put a lil' plain yogurt on a pantyliner...and wear it like that, actually putting the live cultures right where they need to be, but this may be an old wise tale. but other than that, i'd say kombucha tea because it has a zillion tons more live cultures than yogurt and it is good for you overall immune system. and garlic for sure!


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mouse
post Feb 21 2008, 10:50 PM
Post #47


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crossposting in the general knowledge thread--


so, i just got my wisdom teeth out and my dentist prescribed an antibiotic. generally i try to stay far away from antibiotics (i don't think i've taken one in at least ten years, probably more like fifteen) but teeth are near sinuses which are near brain, so i don't want to fuck around with this one. so--i'm taking the antibiotic, which i'm not used to. i've heard that antibiotics often will spark a yeast infection. here's the thing--i've never had a yeast infection (i'm sorry!!) and i don't want to start now. do you guys have any preventative measures that you use when you have to take antibiotics? i've got yogurt anyway cos i can't eat solid food--anything else edible i should be paying attention to? cranberry juice? garlic?

any help would be super appreciated!!! thank you!


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konphusion26
post Feb 20 2008, 12:56 PM
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Hey there chachaheels! I suck at math and measuring stuff LOL So thankfully I don't have to do that for my capsules. I get the size 00 gel caps (I usually use 2 at a time) and made a small paper funnel to make them easier to fill. This was an idea borrowed from another bustie actually.

Then I get like a napkin or something to lay them on after I open the gel caps up. Take the funnel and carefully place it inside one of the capsules, as it fills remove the funnel very slowly. Take a small spoonful of boric acid powder; I put just enough to fill the largest part of the capsule then carefully put the top on it. Once both capsules are filled, I insert them. And please please wear a pad or pantyliner ladies... this stuff will leak out as clear fluid. I use them before bed so that it wont run out so fast at night while i'm sleeping.

I'd use them a few times a week until symptoms of yeast infection have cleared. I don't really get external itching so I dont have any recommendations for that. The clumpy discharge is what bugs me!! I also get a very light buttermilky kind of odor (sorry for TMI ladies)!


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chachaheels
post Feb 20 2008, 07:16 AM
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True, konphusion! Very true. Usually you can find the gel caps in your local pharmacy or health food store, as well as the boric acid in simple apothecary bottles. It's measuring out for accuracy that can be trying...

Have you done this? It would be really helpful if you could post the step-by-steps. The boric acid pessaries themselves are usually put in a solid glycerin matrix so that they melt once inside the body, obviously these will be a little different. But it would really make this treatment accessible for women who don't have a compounding lab nearby (they're getting more and more rare, now that pharmacies and dispensaries are being replaced by stores like Walmart).


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konphusion26
post Feb 19 2008, 11:24 PM
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Boric acid and empty gel caps at amazon.com

super cheap to make your own!!!


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annelise
post Feb 18 2008, 01:01 PM
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yeah, i'm really glad i found the renew line. the price for a 30 day supply was the same as for a 7 day supply of the other stuff, and it really is working, much to my delight.

that activia stuff has seemed gimmicky and suspect to me--i'd rather be taking pills that have guaranteed potency to get my microorganisms in order. foods that are fortified with things always seem like they're missing the point--they're all processed and not necessarily using the best forms/doses of whatever they're supplementing. i'd rather eat real food and supplement what i need with pills that i know to be good quality.

for anyone that lives in chicago, merz apothecary is so great for supplements and stuff (they sell stuff online too). i love my local health food store, but they're tiny and don't always have what i need--the merz guy was the one to tell me about the renew line, and he really took the time to understand what i was looking for and find a product that corresponded.
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chachaheels
post Feb 18 2008, 07:31 AM
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Annelise, it's great that another high potency product's available now. I think the Renew line is a little less pricey (it's formulated for the consumer, not the practitioner, which does make a difference) and I know it's readily available in most health food stores (so even if its not in stock it can be ordered in if the proprietor carries this line).

The higher numbers absolutely make a difference, as does the source of the probiotic life forms. I like the HMF because they are human microflora organisms, cultured from those taken from a healthy woman (so vegans can take them with no problem, and, truly, if you're set on replenishing what's been lost, these are the critters that have been lost). Acidophilus and L.Bifidus are the most important ones to consider after the HMFs, because they're also to be found in the human digestive system.

But everyone beware: I'm seeing an awful lot of scary frankenwhatthefuck? organisms being added to yogurts, and other "milk" products, and these are the ones being promoted to medical doctors (M.D.'s who are finally allowed to listen to their patients who tell them they take probiotics to counteract antibiotic damage to the gut). When I worked in an alternative medical pharmacy in Toronto a while back, those of us on staff who had any training at all cringed when MDs would walk in demanding the Activia yogurts and its "live" probiotic culture, because we all knew those cultures were not real and certainly not the ones we have in our bodies. Many of them would turn their noses up at all the pre and probiotics in stock and insist on the GMO ones, which you knew they'd go out and push on their patients. And these were all MDs who knew nothing about alternatives, as all the schooled MDs we dealt with on an ongoing basis had accounts with us (to benefit their customers).

Lindsey, I've no doubt the methotrexate will change your urine smell (and quite possibly your whole cycle) but the brown discharge may still be a result of the ectopic pregnancy's end. You should have your doctor check you out to see that everything's okay.


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Lindsey
post Feb 16 2008, 03:06 AM
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I recently was told I had a yeast infection by my Ob after finding out I had an ectopic pregnancy... I missed a day (or night I should say) but finished off the treatment. I also took methotrexate to clear everything out of my body. I only bleed for a few days but now I am having brown discharge and my urine smells. Could I still have the yeast infection and would the methotrexate be causing the discharge or smell. Sorry if this is tmi. Just need some help. Thanks!


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annelise
post Feb 16 2008, 01:10 AM
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my naturopath could order the stuff chacha recommended, but i was anxious to start it ASAP so i wouldn't have symptoms...it gets really horrible after antibiotics. so i talked to a local apothecary that has lots of natural remedies and such, and the guy recommended something similar. this is it:


started taking it the day before i finished the antibiotics and the soreness and itchiness i was experiencing diminished within a day. it disappeared completely, after a few days on it. i've never ever had this sort of success with probiotics, and it was wonderful to have things feeling normal so i could enjoy valentine's day with my bf!

i'm totally surprised...popping probiotics always seemed pointless, except in theory, but it's the high doses that really make a difference. thanks so much for your advice, chacha! honestly, i was expecting a few weeks of miserable discomfort and itching. oregano oil helps of course but i was doubtful that it would help completely after a course of antibiotics.
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annelise
post Feb 7 2008, 05:57 PM
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Yeast arrest has a bit of boric acid, but not enough to do the trick for most women.

this was very true for me anyway...i bought a bunch of yeast arrest because i couldn't seem to get a compounding pharmacy to make up boric acid capsules in chicago. it just made me itchier. sad.gif

oregano oil has worked wonderfully for me, but i'm about to go on antibiotics, so it's good to know about the HMF replete. my health food store is going to try to order it for me, and i'm hoping it'll be more effective than the probiotics i've tried before. thanks chacha, as always.
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chachaheels
post Jan 15 2008, 11:30 AM
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They all mail out of province. And often into the United States as well.
Naturopaths are not paid for out of provincial health insurance anywhere in Canada. Everyone pays out of pocket, some have very good health insurance from work which covers access to alternative health care practitioners of different sorts. If you've got health coverage from work, check it out to see if NDs or Homeopaths are covered.

Yeast arrest has a bit of boric acid, but not enough to do the trick for most women.

As for asking your MDs about anything that is not conventional medicine, chances are excellent (unless they show bona fide credentials--three to five year diplomas or certification of completed study in any alternative medical discipline) they will know nothing about it whatsoever, and will quite likely feel very threatened by your questions no matter how innocuous they are. If an MD doesn't know that there is a demonstrable link between extreme hormonal fluctuation and susceptibility to yeast and fungal infections of all kinds, then I am at a loss to explain why they don't know. Just chalk it up to it being "out of their area of expertise" and select better sources for information than your MD.


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Celina!
post Jan 8 2008, 09:26 PM
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Nope, not toronto unfortunately. I'm in manitoba. I don't imagine the pharmecy does mail order inter-province..?
It seems our general healthcare doesn't cover naturopathic doctors and I don't really have the means to fund a visit at the moment. I can give it a shot with my normal MD, but she said she'd never heard of birth control causing yeast infections, so my outlook isn't great. I'll keep poking my head into health food stores for yeast arrest (simplest way for me to get boric acid, I think) and HMF replete. I really don't want to take the risk of doing myself damage by winging it with the stuff off the shelf, as the pharmacist said they add a base (I assume in the sense of an alcaline product) when they prepare the pessarys. Worse comes to worse I'll order online, just hoping to avoid exorbant shipping rates.

Sorry for hijacking the thread unsure.gif
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chachaheels
post Jan 5 2008, 07:41 AM
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If you're in Toronto, there are a couple of pharmacies you can try for the Boric Acid. I used to work in one in Toronto and we used boric acid from a different source (from the one we sold on the shelves) though someone has said on this board that they did have some success making up boric acid capsules by buying the boric acid powder and empty capsules, then assembling the capsules themselves at home. The one thing you'd need, of course, is an accurate measure for the right dose. Otherwise, you can get a RX from any naturopath (the vast majority of MDs wouldn't have a clue what to use boric acid for)...and actually the pharmacy I know of in Toronto often makes them up in advance and sells them without prescription. They do mail order.

I know of other sources in Ontario if you're in that province. Let me know: they also sell the complete Seroyal/Genestra line, and the HMF Replete's easy to find and available without prescription.


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Celina!
post Jan 4 2008, 07:34 PM
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Thankyou for the advice! I'll try your suggestions as soon as I can (I hope its not too dificult to get HMF replete in canada..)

Anyway, I went to my local compounding pharmacy and discovered that a prescription is needed to have them make up the pessarys. They had powdered boric acid in a bottle without prescription but I'm weary of the safety of making it up myself. The bottle only said to dilute 1/2 tsp of the powder into such and such amount of water for topical use. Is this one okay for making into a vaginal suppository or should I leave it up to the professionals? huh.gif
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chachaheels
post Jan 4 2008, 05:00 PM
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Hi Celina, Happy and Healthy New Year, everyone!

I think using the boric acid once a day for two weeks or twice a day for a week might work well if your yeast infection is mild, but you must keep something in mind: it isn't something that is happening out of context. It is taking place because of the hormonal state your body is in. If it recurs (and it has) then you are dealing with something that isn't "mild" anymore. The hormonal state your body's in actually makes you susceptible to yeast (and other fungal) infections. So you have to consider other approaches. Boric acid's a great "get me out of this misery" treatment, far better than just using diflucan or nystatin or any of those drugstore brand anti-biotics, which only have temporary effects. The boric acid can often soothe any itchiness and pain and actually help your body to heal itself. You won't get these effects with the anti-biotics and anti-fungals, which are just suppressive.

Next, I'd really take an aggressive approach with restoring the human microflora that's disappeared with the use of the pill. The over the counter acidophilus pills just don't do what's necessary, and at this stage replacing what's actually vital--the microflora that's present in a healthy female body which does not succumb to yeast--would be the best thing to take. There is one product (I really wish this were more readily available and made by other companies, but it's not) that I keep recommending, a 7 day treatment called HMF Replete by Genestra/Seroyal. It is available online or through a practitioner, but I do know some really good holistic pharmacies and some health food stores carry this line. It's pricey, but it will make a huge difference in restoring your health so that yeast doesn't continue to recur.

Another option is capsules of oregano oil which you could use for a short course of time, as a support. Oregano oil contains carvacrol, which kills off yeast organisms that have overgrown; more than that, though, oregano oil can actually help your body to do away with the overgrowth of yeast and re-balancing its own stores of microflora so that he hormonal imbalance caused by the pill doesn't have such a drastic effect. I think most women find taking the capsules of oregano oil easier to deal with as the actual oil itself has an intense oregano flavour and it often burns.

Use the microflora "replete" for a week, the boric acid for a week, and the oregano oil capsules for about a month or so, and you should see lasting improvements, even against the "maintaining cause" that is the pill. I get that it's convenient and pretty reliable...I just wish it wasn't so freaking damaging, is all.

Good luck with it...let me know if you feel better, as I hope you do, soon.


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