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> Frustrated Singles
katiebelle2882
post Sep 14 2006, 01:43 PM
Post #881


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From: NYC


do they exist greenbean? cause if they do we need to find those boys cause i am totally with you on that. that is EXACTLY what i need too. damn!


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“There's something about the Irish that is remarkable.”-François de la Rochefoucauld
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greenbean
post Sep 14 2006, 01:35 PM
Post #882


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Katie, I'm with you: my most carnal experiences were when I was quick to hop in the sack. I think I have a weakness for Alpha males, the kind of guys that the nice boys whince at cuz its so easy for them to get laid.....but then whenever I snag an Alpha it backfires on me cuz I always want to keep them around, and theyre like, "Um, I cant be tied down, blah blah blah".

I guess I need a guy who can be sweet and loving and respectful outside of bed, but have the intuition (or knowledge, I guess I just need to be blunt) that I need to be manhandled and maybe a bit 'disrespected' when taken to bed. I suppose I need to give the nice boys a chance, and hope that I can unleash the 'bad boy' under the surface...


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I thank God I was raised Catholic, so sex will always be dirty.--John Waters
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katiebelle2882
post Sep 14 2006, 08:34 AM
Post #883


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From: NYC


sassy it's so great to see you so excited about this boy!

i think i am a freak of nature. some of the best sex i have ever had have been one night stands (or a short term hookup buddy). after about 4 months i am bored to tears with a boyfriend, and its not like they are bad or dont know how to please me. hence why monogamy hasnt really been working out for me. in fact every single time i have been like WOW that was some awesome sex, it was a one night stand. then again, i get off easier then most guys do so its not like i have to worry about that.

i just dont like the slow tender blah sex that comes with relationships. one night stands are always so carnal, so much more passionate, then anything i have ever experienced with a boyfriend. with boyfriends that "i want you now" feeling leaves almost as soon as it comes. besides my first maybe, and that was just bc i was a virgin. i dont know, this is why everyone is different.


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sassygrrl
post Sep 14 2006, 03:10 AM
Post #884


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Raises slobbering hand...heh. Thanks Kal baby!

We shall see on Sunday eh? I'll see if I can control my slutty self. He wants to cook me dinner. How groovy is that? I love me a boy who cooks. smile.gif And he has dogs. Which is so rad.

I agree with you on the sex bit, and that the fact that discovery (sexually as well as intellectual and otherwise) is one of the best parts. In my opinion, first go around sex can always be really uncomfortable and weird.

Going to keep kissing boy hopefully... yay. smile.gif





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Kalevra
post Sep 14 2006, 12:29 AM
Post #885


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Wow!

There are some really different views on this subject, it makes for a good debate (a mass-debate maybe *ahem*)

Stargazer, totally agree on the kiss thing, a kiss says a lot about a persons feelings abilities and sincerity, and also is a great way to test compatibility, not only in a sexual way, but a 'comfort' way....if you get my drift. You think I am wrong, lookit the slobbering Saasy over there *points* smile.gif that there is chemistry right. What we don't know is how HE feels right now.....

On the topic of sex on a first date/one-nighter, in myHUMBLE experience, I say humble because the number of casuals I have had, I can count on one hand, is normally bad sex. People have very different requirements sexually,....and there is LITTLE chance that people press each others buttons the right way, on the very first go. I say little chance, I do not assume that it cannot happen. Let's say you think the sex is FANTASTIC, and you have now deduced that you can proceed with a relationship, now that that issue has been addressed....what about the other person....maybe they didn't get what they want.....or were just 'going through the motions'.....pretty one sided now, yes?
The courtship thing allows us to assess the other person, on a mental level, and then, based on that, the physical side of things can be addressed.
I am going to use my own example here, as I have experienced it, I am not saying this is how it should be with everyone, but it has applied to me.
With my ex, I knew her in work, casual acquaintence type of way, and in the year I 'knew' her, there was a little chemistry between us, nothing crazy. In the course of one week, we got a lot closer, and eventually the kiss just 'happened' on us, no expectation.....great kiss, and both of us admit to this day, that that kiss was a mutually fantastic one. Anyway, sex follwed shortly thereafter, and we were both a little cautious and careful, it was not instantly rewarding, and in fact 2 weeks later we were still on discovery road, and by the end of a month, all we needed to know about each others sexual likes/dislikes was not in 'black and white' ...a year later, we were still experimenting, and the sex got better and better all the time....

I guess what I am saying is that, for me, discovery is a great part of the whole concept, whether it is a fuck buddy, serious relationship or whatever......it just feels right to go down that avenue with slow, deliberate actions....

Jayziz, never realised how much I can WAFFLE on....probably the frustration creeping in laugh.gif



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I like to keep a bottle of drink handy in case I see a snake, which I also keep handy - W.C. Fields
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stargazer
post Sep 13 2006, 11:11 PM
Post #886


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greenbean~i had a similar experience...not with sex...but with kissing...and kissing gets me going...i like foreplay and kissing is a great way to turn me on...so, i really enjoyed talking with this one guy...we would have 3 hour phone conversations...i would admit i was not immediately turned on by him...but, i enjoyed talking with him...i did all of the "right" things like not kissing him on the first date...just getting to know him...it was nice...but, then i kissed him...horrible...completely turned me off...i started to fantasize that sex would be equally cold and technical...there was no passion...i ended things soon after...

i don't really think about the sex part. that's strange. i kinda base things on my initial attraction and go from there.

sassygrrl~it is tough. i feel your pain. but, if his kissing is great, then i'm sure everything else will work.

bella coola~you're not cheesy. you had a valid point. there were times where things just felt right to have sex with someone. at the same time, we had some difficulty getting to know one another. and we were not right for each other come to think of it. i guess i keep kickin' myself 'cause i was so impulsive with mcrush because i didn't think i would see him again (the 2 times we ran into each other were pretty random) and i didn't think he would like me...well, i didn't give him a chance. and yes, i know it is self esteem issues going on here. i slept with him thinking i would see him again and had different feelings about him afterwards. and him the same with me. i don't know...sometimes i think it was meant to happen to teach me what i've been doing wrong in my relationships with men. mcrush was the first man in years where i looked at him before i even met him and thought, "i wanna be with him." i feel like i messed up big time. damn.

but, i guess i know better for next time....whenever that is....


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"I'm not impressed easily. Wow! A blue car!"-Homer Simpson
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bella coola
post Sep 13 2006, 07:25 PM
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Hey, if you fine ladies don't mind I'm going to bust out the cheesy clicheness.

I think you've got to do what's right for you - your heart, or guts, or both will probably tell you the best plan of attack. Maybe attack isn't the right word. Or...

With some guys, you gotta jump the 'gun' (and find out right away if he knows how to fire) but others it's better to take it easy and see how it goes. That's what I've found, anyway. I try to just really listen to myself - try and quiet all the hormonal and 'what if' things to get to the good stuff.

Oh, and you go sassygirl, with your fantastic kissing by the car
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sassygrrl
post Sep 13 2006, 05:08 PM
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I find it weird too. Like I really want to sleep with McCrush, but I don't want to be a super slut (this is what got me in trouble with SC boy), b/c I moved way too fast with him. We'll see. That kiss by the car last night, hot damn almighty. My knees were weak.

There's something about delayed gratification I admit, but what if the sex sucks??

I don't think that it sounds too high maintance at all.

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greenbean
post Sep 13 2006, 05:04 PM
Post #889


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Hello! Thought I'd pop in since I'm experiencing the whole 'courtship' right now..
I agree with Bella that some guys really ARE sincere and respectful, and have more intentions in mind than just getting laid. That said, I do tend to be 'easy' when it comes to certain cocky guys that just bluntly talk me up and try and bed me. (not all guys mind you but the ones that are really good at it).

This may sound sad, but it seems easier to sleep with someone first and then 'date', cuz if the sex was good you can look foward to doing it again, but if it was bad then you can shrug the thing off as a one-night stand.

With this courtship thing, you get to know the guy/go slow, but theres the whole looming question of "will he be good in bed?". Maybe I'm paranoid cuz I have been through this senario with a guy who was really nice, funny, took me on dates...but when we got around to having sex, it was awful! Then I had to give him the hint that I wasn't interested anymore without totally destroying his ego.

Of course on the other side, I have been a long term relationship that started out with sex/no courtship, and I began to really resent him. It was as if since I was so easy in the beginning, he felt like he never had to do any romantic gestures, which after a while I started to want (yes, I can be a sucker for flowers).

Ugg, I sound so high-maintainence! Sorry if this didnt help the discussion any! Just a bit of stream-of-conscience typing here...


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I thank God I was raised Catholic, so sex will always be dirty.--John Waters
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sassygrrl
post Sep 13 2006, 04:01 PM
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I think it also comes down to respect. I just miss it. Every one is so wanting to fuck everyone now adays, (not that there's anything wrong with sex), but I just miss it.

Boy I'm seeing now is sort of doing it right. Even sending me cute little emails, which is really sweet.
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katiebelle2882
post Sep 12 2006, 10:59 AM
Post #891


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From: NYC


yeah i could totally see that bella. i just feel that most of the time, its too affected. but i agree there are definitly times where its sincere.


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bella coola
post Sep 12 2006, 10:31 AM
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Well maybe there's two types of courtship. Because what I experienced was quite honest, I can see that still looking back. The respect outweighed desire or something, you know?

There was a 'frog' that gave me 'please don't dump me flowers', they sure didn't work. So I think I get where you're coming from KB, and I don't appreciate phony game playing either.
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katiebelle2882
post Sep 12 2006, 09:19 AM
Post #893


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eh-see, it doesnt appeal to me in the least. too over the top fake and romantic and blahhhh. so staged. i dont want flowers, bring me beer! courtship to me=playing games, and i rather not even remotely get into that. you want to just have sex, then fine lets leave it at that. you like me more then that, then tell me and we can deal with that from there. no accepting and rejecting and impressing me. i've made up my mind within the first hour of knowing you if i want to date you or not, and within the first 5 min whether i would sleep with you or not.


i guess its a nice idea. to each their own i suppose


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“There's something about the Irish that is remarkable.”-François de la Rochefoucauld
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bella coola
post Sep 12 2006, 09:09 AM
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Even at my tender age, I have had the pleasure of being 'courted'. A couple of times, both happened fairly similarly.

I think that it comes down to RESPECT. Sing it Arethra. Both fellas were accepting, even appreciative of my 'pace'. And appreciative of ME! I wasn't just another girl. They courted me to get to know me (for me), and of course the libidos were raging but they never rushed me. Not even a little bit. Within a month or so I 'scared them off', I think maybe because they're used to the modern version of dating. But it was worth it, being smitten is effen priceless.

So courtship still exists for sure, in my opinion. It's a rare jewel, so keep your eyes peeled! That's one thing about internet dating. In some cases, it is reviving shivalry - writing letters. Sure they're typed rather than written, but it's still extended correspondence that the person writes him/herself. I've recieved some fairly fantastic emails from fellas... keep the faith, sistahs! (and brothas)!
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stargazer
post Sep 12 2006, 12:12 AM
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kalevra~that was lovely.

there is definitely an emphasis on getting to know the "person." more respect to their humanness and being comfortable with some tension in getting to know a woman. more mystery to the person which draws you near and makes you want to be closer to them. really a commitment to "dating" someone. people do not use the word "date" anymore. "hanging out" has replaced "dating", which seems so informal. uh, if you can't use the word "date," then i question how you will handle intimacy all together.

i definitely agree with acts of affections (flowers/cards/mixtapes) as nice gestures of caring. especially when they are unexpected and not demanded...a true sign of a giving person.

ack. i miss this courtship thing.

today i was identifying with the story taming of the shrew...too many opinions about relationships...i told a friend i feel sorry for the man who wants to date me...i will definitely be a challenge...all of my fears with intimacy and trust issues with men will be tested...i never said i was for the weak at heart...

oh, and listening to aimee mann's bachlorette no. 2 cd and magnolia soundtrack really speaks to my frustrated singleness....


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Kalevra
post Sep 11 2006, 10:00 PM
Post #896


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Courtship……not easy to explain in so much as there are many contexts in which it is used. In matters of the heart, it has always been the place of a man, to win his ‘maiden’ over, to WOO her and ultimately gain her affection. Not an easy task, I can tell you.

In some instances, the courtship is a formal affair, for instances, the Indian/Hindu way to marriage is through an arrangement between two sets of parents. The decision is made (financial obligations settled, yuck!) and only then does courtship proceed, and it is by the book! pre-conceived step-by-step! 65% of my colleagues are in arranged marriages, although I CANNOT even bear to think of it as an option, discussions with them have lead me to alter my stance on the viability of the idea. I still think it is un-natural though. dry.gif

Courtship – The Little House on the Prairie version:
In normal terms (to Western beliefs that is), a man might be required to ‘impress’ his lady, and she in turn, must be impressed by him! This task is made difficult by the simple fact that humans have little sub-conscious games; that all day long, get played out between each other. The most common of these games is the acceptance/rejection game. And this game is not only played between the opposing sexes, we play it on our sexual brethren (eep sisters, sisters, I meant sisters….! Whew) This game is played in everyday life take business for example, accept a person in your office, reject his product as unnecessary; accept business offer, then reject it until your price is right etc etc, you get the picture..
Ok, so now a man approaches a girl with the intention of getting to know her better (he likes her, her beauty and attention draw him in), she accepts his initial advance, but then has to reject him lightly (not wanting to appear too keen, or god-forbid –EASY). So he goes off again, but he now has something of hers, INTEREST and of course her phone number, so he will call her! He does so and asks her on a date, she accepts his offer, but rejects the idea of Thursday evening, says Friday would be better (making sure it is done on her terms). He arrives with flowers, he knows girls love flowers, but these are special flowers, he so needs her to like HIS flowers. And they go off on a date…..the talk is nervous, but reassuring, she is warming to him, but again needs to know how dedicated he is, will he be a good partner & provider, so at the end of the night when he leans in for the kiss on the doorstep, she turns away, but does come back to give him a ‘peck’ on the cheek ( he now knows she is responsive to his advances, but wants him to take it slower). And so days, and weeks pass, and eventually mutual respect, admiration and in a few cases, adoration take over, she succumbs to his advances because she now knows him, trusts him and feels like spending time with him, and they live happily ever after…in love, forever! rolleyes.gif

Courtship – The Modern Version. (Please excuse me if it seems a little crass, but this is where it is headed, methinks)

Get her smashed up ( Frozen Margherita’s work well for this I am told) give her some bullsh*t speech about being a helicopter pilot/lion-tamer/dolphin trainer….Hey Presto

We all still like the former, right?


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I like to keep a bottle of drink handy in case I see a snake, which I also keep handy - W.C. Fields
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sassygrrl
post Sep 11 2006, 05:33 PM
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I would want it back if the men actually enjoyed the act of it. Like take for instance, the bullshit that is Valentine's day. But, like getting flowers or a cool card for no reason at all would be cool. Or just taking things slow. Am I making any sense? I'm not sappy either (the reason I hate VDAY so much is that's it's so damn close to my bday... and men have always pulled that joint gift bs at me).

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katiebelle2882
post Sep 11 2006, 03:34 PM
Post #898


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From: NYC


yeah i am just confused as to what it entails. i do have to say that i dont want it back if it involved stuff that men feel they need to do to get women to sleep with them but dont enjoy doing. you know, along the same lines as sappy anniversary cards and stuff like that. i dont want to generalize bc i know all mena rent like that, but i rather just be real about stuff then have a guy feel he *needs* to do it as opposed to wanting to. i am also not sappy, but thats just me.

Kal, go for the description since you seem to have something in mind. perhaps it would make more sense coming from a guy since thats what we are talking about here anyway.


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sassygrrl
post Sep 11 2006, 03:18 PM
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I wonder that too. It seems so outdated nowadays. But, damn. I miss it!! Kal, your opinion is welcome luvie.


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princessinabox
post Sep 11 2006, 02:50 PM
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I'd like to hear a male perspective on that one...feel free. I'm wondering if people think courtship still exists?
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